A message from DJ Shadow...

For all your off topic conversation requirements. No posts about gigs please, use the Music forum. As usual, no "NSFW" material, keep it clean.
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Direkt
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by Direkt » Wed Jan 13, 2010 2:52 am

almax wrote:Well if you read the sentence direktly (see what i did there) after what you quoted

almax wrote: But i guess if you were good enough of a musician, classically trained etc etc, what are the chances that you would be mass produced and pirated heavily? Most of these musicians would be earning coin from playing in orchestras and what not yeah? So pirating for them wouldnt be as much of an issue.


whats the percentage of musicians that come out of the VCA and colleges just like it all over the world to produce their own album?

I liked what you did there.

"Good enough musician" and "classically trained" are obviously not mutually inclusive.

So, there's HEAPS of good musicians, many of whom have been trained professionally to some level - who aren't making a cent.

That's kinda what I was getting at. Anyway, I'm off to L.A. :wink:

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by Andrez » Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:07 am

Me? I'm just dusting down my personal Lear Jet for my next jaunt down to Oz.
Shame it's a Matchbox die-cast scaled-down version I can't even squeeze my pinkie into.

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by Direkt » Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:47 am

What do you mean by pinkie?

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by almax » Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:52 am

Direkt wrote:What do you mean by pinkie?



:lol:

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by FullGain » Wed Jan 13, 2010 2:52 pm

I'll be back.

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Wed Jan 13, 2010 4:06 pm

its gay code for I want to sex you up.
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by FullGain » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:36 pm

youthful_implants wrote:its gay code for I want to sex you up.


hehehehe........so how do you know that? :smt003
I'll be back.

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:26 pm

FullGain wrote:
youthful_implants wrote:its gay code for I want to sex you up.


hehehehe........so how do you know that? :smt003


well I have got two pinkies to start with, would be a shame for them to go waste. :3some:
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by Andrez » Thu Jan 14, 2010 10:01 am

youthful_implants wrote:
FullGain wrote:
youthful_implants wrote:its gay code for I want to sex you up.


hehehehe........so how do you know that? :smt003


well I have got two pinkies to start with, would be a shame for them to go waste. :3some:


Ye gods... ;)

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by Gliding High » Fri Jan 15, 2010 4:21 pm

DBoy wrote:From his website...
http://djshadow.com/

WARNING: RAMBLING TIRADE FROM A 37-YEAR OLD TECHNOPHOBE BELOW

Well, here we are again, another year, another decade. Optimism about the future is tempered with a nagging sense that underlying factors causing most of the misery in the world still exist. Lucky, then, that I’m a musician and not a politician.

Specifically, when it comes to the wallet, everyone’s suffering…of that there can be no doubt. And what of the financial prospects for musicians and recording artists in the years to come? Shaky, at best. Unless you’re one of the grotesque ‘Idol’-type pop disasters in the top 5, you’re looking at getting a day job or finding other sources of income. Conventional wisdom amongst my peers has been remarkably short-sided over the last decade: “Yeah, CD sales are down, but all the money is in licensing.” Not anymore. “Yeah, licensing money is down, but the video game industry is killing it.” Less so these days, according to recent data. “Well, the real money is in touring.” Really? When was the last time you saw a ‘new,’ post-record company artist headline a major music festival? At this rate, we’ll be stuck with Coldplay for decades (no offense intended).

Time for a little straight talk, from one reasonably intelligent human being to YOU, the reasonably intelligent reader. As distasteful as it may sound, the fact is that so many of our heroes: Jimi Hendrix, John Coltrane, The Beatles, whoever you care to name; generated much of their best art in return for financial compensation. If you take away the compensation, guess what…the art stops. For example, how many young rap artists are grinding away these days in New York, trying to get a deal? Not too many, certainly compared to the ‘80s and ‘90s. There’s no allure, no pot at the end of the rainbow. People have been asking for years now, “Where’s the next Nas, the next Jay-Z?” Be prepared to keep waiting…and for music, overall, to keep sucking. Why? Because only bottom-of-the-barrel, embarrassing pop tripe generates enough income to feed the machine. Anything unproven or risky? Nobody’s going to bankroll that kind of ‘experiment.’

Let me be clear: I love music. I love the culture of music, making music, playing music, geeking out over music from the past and present. I love old record company stories, and the characters that inhabited it. In other words, I have learned to appreciate the merchants of commerce as well as the art. If you love movies or cars, chances are you can relate to what I’m describing. What would Hollywood be without the larger-than-life, audacious personalities behind the scenes? What would cars be like if there had never been Detroit?

Gone are the recording studios (including the historically important Plant down the road from me in Sausalito), the record shops, and the music magazines. Replaced by the oh-so-cynical, oh-so-corrosive AM talk radio of the new millennium, the Internet. But I’m not telling you anything you don’t already know. Chances are, you may have even been one of those majority who danced on the grave of the falling record companies, pointed to Radiohead giving their album away for free and said, “See, look, if they can do it, why can’t everyone else?” Slowly, I turn…

Every artist is entitled to their own price point, just as every consumer has a choice in what they purchase. Nobody puts a gun to someone’s head and says, “Hey, buy this Picasso for 20 million.” Likewise, if $9.99 is too much to spend for one of my albums, so be it, your choice. But if you’re holding your breath, waiting for me to boost my cool-quotient by giving my music away for free, it’s not going to happen. The fact is that I feel my music has value. You may disagree, and that’s fine. But I know how much energy I put into what I do, and how long it takes me to make something I’m satisfied with. Giving that away just feels wrong to me. It’s not about money per se; I can donate a large sum of money to charity and not think twice, but I won’t give my art away. I’d rather sell it to 100 people who value it as I do than give it away to 1000 who could care less. That’s MY choice.

I realize these are all unpopular subjects. Artists are never supposed to address their flock about such icky subjects as business and commerce. (By the way, and I hope it doesn’t sound disingenuous, but now would be a REALLY good time to express my undying THANKS for your support, which matters IMMENSELY in my ability to retain music as my primary endeavor. As a fan of others, I always used to wonder, “does this artist or group really care about whether I buy their stuff or not? Do they care that I go to their show?” YES, WE CARE!!!!! Now, more than ever). Most think that I should stop whining, grow up and embrace the Internet, become more active, tweet more, hype more, give more stuff away, etc, etc. Honestly, I’ve tried…and will keep trying. But the bottom line is that not every paradigm or system is right for everyone. We’ve all been told for years that the Internet is our Savior; it’s cool, youthful, hip, the solution to every problem, and if you aren’t joining a new networking site on a weekly basis, you’re a social pariah. Sorry…I just don’t feel that way. I’m old enough to know that when 99% of the population is marching lockstep in one direction, sometimes it’s wise to break rank and go the other way. Plus, I simply don’t like sitting in front of a computer screen all day.

I’m not saying that I don’t use the Internet on a regular basis; I do. And obviously I’m very proud of this site and its ability to support itself through the store. Honestly, I just think a large portion of the dialogue and content available online is an utter shit fest: a Pandora’s box of violence, neurosis, bad impulses, and bad intentions. It has become the “Super Horror Show” the Last Poets could never have dreamed of, like bad television on steroids and angel dust simultaneously. CL Smooth memorably called television “a schism…negative realism.” And much like the TV of the ‘60s and ‘70s, you will NEVER hear or read anything negative about the Internet ON the Internet. There’s too much money to be made, by someone somewhere (and hey, why ruffle the feathers of the goose that’s laying the golden egg, right?). 20 years from now, it will be interesting to see what hindsight reveals. I predict a flag on the time-line: when we moved closer to becoming a passionless, listless, hollowed-out society, one in which art and nature could no longer provide the psychological shock to the system required to endure another harrowing day of terror alerts and super-bugs. Music can only suggest sex and violence…the Internet provides both, full frontal and full strength, 24/7. Maximum dose.

Whatever…what will be will be. As long as I breathe, I’ll make music, love music, support music. I used to get in fights at school to defend my right to listen to rap, and I’ll fight on against any institution or prevailing thinking that seeks to dictate to me how and when the music I make is to be disseminated. If there’s 50 of you, or 100, or more out there willing to accept my right to choose, as I accept yours, then welcome aboard…you are my fan base. The rest of you that don’t, and want me to play someone else’s game…I wish you well. Let’s just leave the subject at that and call it what it is: a mutual misunderstanding.

Regardless, it’s going to be a hell of a year. I am working hard on new music, and hope to share some of it with you in the coming months (really!). I’m fully aware that there are many former fans that insist my best work is behind me. Well, respectfully, I disagree. It’s not easy walking the tightrope between artistic validity and financial solvency, but I stand behind all of the decisions I have made to date. What matters to me is that EVERYONE reading this knows that I take my career, my music, and my fans EXTREMELY SERIOUSLY. When I started in music 25 years ago, my mission was to provide an alternative, to expand the scope of choice available to music lovers like myself; and above all to demonstrate a willingness to go the extra mile and put the MAXIMUM EFFORT in EVERYTHING I DO, so that the bar continues to be raised, not lowered. Whether that manifests itself on stage, on record, or as a character in a video game, I honestly feel that I have given it my best, win or lose, and I’m proud of that. I have to believe that your continued support is a vote of confidence, which I take great comfort in as I strive to create some of my best work to date.

I may not be the best looking dude out there…I may not be the most linked-in, the most prolific, the most successful…but I’ll be god-damned if I’m not up there with the most passionate. If you agree with what I’m saying, that so much music we’re fed is utter GARBAGE that insults the intelligence, then no matter where you’re at…the States, the UK, France, Japan, Canada, Australia, wherever…we’re ALL outsiders, and we owe it to each other to band together and fight for something better. Personally, I’m loving the challenge, and when the time is right, I look forward to reconnecting with all of you.

Until then…

DJ Shadow


I think that was brilliantly written, and more importantly, gutsy as fuck.
Got to respect a man who says it how it is - there aint many of us left. :smt001
I personally would much rather be a passionate artist pushing boundaries than some grovelling arse-kisser making some generic pap for the uneducated, oblivious mainstream masses - or for any unmoving stagnant genre that is happy not to progress forward, for that matter. (Or worse yet, being some 'wooting' twat who pays to see that shit)
Personally, hearing other people take sounds to a new level appeals much more to me than the same old safe shit that is rife in the mainstream, and also rife in supposed 'underground' dance music.
As far as I'm concerned, he's allowed to be pissed, and he has a relevant gripe. I mean, seeing arse-hats like the Potbellies or Mika make bazzillions by getting tons of mainstream play is enough to make you want to load up your AK and do some quality time up a clock tower.
Nice one Josh.
Now bring out something as good as Endtroducing ya cunt :smt002

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by Amick » Fri Jan 15, 2010 4:38 pm

One of the best threads i've read on here in awhile...

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Post by ghetto kitty » Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:47 pm

Edit : almost had an opinion but it got lost in Friday randomness hehe

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by ghostsoul » Sat Jan 16, 2010 3:29 pm

word

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by FunkyJ » Sat Jan 16, 2010 3:57 pm

Gliding High wrote:I think that was brilliantly written, and more importantly, gutsy as fuck.
Got to respect a man who says it how it is - there aint many of us left. :smt001
I personally would much rather be a passionate artist pushing boundaries than some grovelling arse-kisser making some generic pap for the uneducated, oblivious mainstream masses - or for any unmoving stagnant genre that is happy not to progress forward, for that matter. (Or worse yet, being some 'wooting' twat who pays to see that shit)
Personally, hearing other people take sounds to a new level appeals much more to me than the same old safe shit that is rife in the mainstream, and also rife in supposed 'underground' dance music.
As far as I'm concerned, he's allowed to be pissed, and he has a relevant gripe. I mean, seeing arse-hats like the Potbellies or Mika make bazzillions by getting tons of mainstream play is enough to make you want to load up your AK and do some quality time up a clock tower.
Nice one Josh.


Boundary pushing my arse!

Outsider was a booty beats fest written clearly to cash in on radio hiphop.

I have spent countless hours writing about, reading about, and listening to music. I spend thousands of dollars a year on music.

I notice that all these people who are whinging about the state of the industry haven't done a decent album in years.

Fuck all these people.

Come out with a decent album and I'll buy it. Until then, fuck off!
Ready to drop, Audio rock, here comes the boy from the South!
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by apophenian » Sat Jan 16, 2010 4:43 pm

It's interesting to hear RZA's thoughts on downloading (From wikipedia):

RZA wrote:To me digital downloading hasn't been a major problem for the music industry. Yeah, I think they are inflating the problem... First of all, it gives them another avenue to cheat the artists and to cheat the people that are supposed to get paid and it gives them a chance to throw another surplus and also to give the government. You know how the airlines, all of the sudden the airlines say they lost money because of 9-11. And they give the airlines billions and billions of dollars, and yet the people who could use the money, like the poor people in the country, or the middle class, or the health care people, they get nothing. Who cares if the airlines are losing money when the citizens are really the ones that's suffering since 9-11? So, I think the same thing of the music industry. They can't say that they're losing money, you know what I'm saying. They just probably don't have the same surplus that they had.

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Sat Jan 16, 2010 6:55 pm

FunkyJ wrote:
Gliding High wrote:I think that was brilliantly written, and more importantly, gutsy as fuck.
Got to respect a man who says it how it is - there aint many of us left. :smt001
I personally would much rather be a passionate artist pushing boundaries than some grovelling arse-kisser making some generic pap for the uneducated, oblivious mainstream masses - or for any unmoving stagnant genre that is happy not to progress forward, for that matter. (Or worse yet, being some 'wooting' twat who pays to see that shit)
Personally, hearing other people take sounds to a new level appeals much more to me than the same old safe shit that is rife in the mainstream, and also rife in supposed 'underground' dance music.
As far as I'm concerned, he's allowed to be pissed, and he has a relevant gripe. I mean, seeing arse-hats like the Potbellies or Mika make bazzillions by getting tons of mainstream play is enough to make you want to load up your AK and do some quality time up a clock tower.
Nice one Josh.


Boundary pushing my arse!

Outsider was a booty beats fest written clearly to cash in on radio hiphop.

I have spent countless hours writing about, reading about, and listening to music. I spend thousands of dollars a year on music.

I notice that all these people who are whinging about the state of the industry haven't done a decent album in years.

Fuck all these people.

Come out with a decent album and I'll buy it. Until then, fuck off!


oh dear. :smt005 :roll:

everyone's a critic haha!

you go in the 'doesn't really like music pile' :teef:

I love music but I hate music snobs.
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Re:

Post by Andrez » Sun Jan 17, 2010 10:12 am

ghetto kitty wrote:Edit : almost had an opinion but it got lost in Friday randomness hehe


That always happens to me, Kitty... ;)

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by nic » Sun Jan 17, 2010 10:56 am

yes good opinions
i love u all in equal measures

remember

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by FunkyJ » Sun Jan 17, 2010 10:58 am

youthful_implants wrote:oh dear. :smt005 :roll:

everyone's a critic haha!

you go in the 'doesn't really like music pile' :teef:

I love music but I hate music snobs.


I don't know about everyone, but I am a music critic, and have been writing and talking about music critically for the last 10 years.

However, I do try to listen to anything and everything.

For example, I've spent hours listening to dubstep mixes and paying to see DJs play dubstep, in the hope I'd finally understand why so many people whose music taste I usually admire really like it. There are a few good tracks here and there, but on the whole I don't like it - it's not to my taste.

However, this is not something a "music snob" would do. A music snob wouldn't waste their time and money on it at all.

Just because I'm discerning doesn't make me a snob.

Because of the Internet, people are more discerning. They won't listen to any old shit the radio and TV play any more.

Add to this the growth of other past times in the last 10 years - the explosion of video games, the explosion of gym memberships, the explosion of DVD sales, the explosion in international tourism, the explosion of work hours - people have less time to listen to music, and more things to spend their money on - people have to be discerning.

And this is what Shadow and Bono and all these other people are failing to recognise.
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Sun Jan 17, 2010 11:39 am

FunkyJ wrote:
youthful_implants wrote:oh dear. :smt005 :roll:

everyone's a critic haha!

you go in the 'doesn't really like music pile' :teef:

I love music but I hate music snobs.


I don't know about everyone, but I am a music critic, and have been writing and talking about music critically for the last 10 years.

However, I do try to listen to anything and everything.

For example, I've spent hours listening to dubstep mixes and paying to see DJs play dubstep, in the hope I'd finally understand why so many people whose music taste I usually admire really like it. There are a few good tracks here and there, but on the whole I don't like it - it's not to my taste.

However, this is not something a "music snob" would do. A music snob wouldn't waste their time and money on it at all.

Just because I'm discerning doesn't make me a snob.

Because of the Internet, people are more discerning. They won't listen to any old shit the radio and TV play any more.

Add to this the growth of other past times in the last 10 years - the explosion of video games, the explosion of gym memberships, the explosion of DVD sales, the explosion in international tourism, the explosion of work hours - people have less time to listen to music, and more things to spend their money on - people have to be discerning.

And this is what Shadow and Bono and all these other people are failing to recognise.


For someone so 'discerning' how come you dont realise that piracy has absolutely nothing to with quality or what you think is good?

I couldn't give two hoots whether or not you think you've got great taste, that has no bearing on whther artists get ripped off and complain.

Do you really think that you know something that they dont about the music industry when you say they are 'failing to recognise?' :lol:

Doesn't matter if its Shadow, Bono, Britney, Megadeath or a local band that no one's heard of. They might all be affected by people stealing their music and have a right to complain about it.

You say that people are more discerning now because of the internet. Are you joking?

The traditional quality control in media is gone, any idiot can have a fluke hit single, or a million views on youtube, thanks to the nature of viral media. Does that make it a quality product, just cos loads of people like it? No, not at all. For every sub-genre or cult phenomenon on the internet there are a million bands, film-makers or whathaveyou with experience and talent doing all the right things (touring, online stores, physical stores, myspace, twitter, facebook, blogs) who will never make a dime. Not because they're not good, not solely because the chances are people are stealing their music but because they're lost in an ocean of other dross with no sensible, straightforward or logical way to make themselves stand out. Not even with good music.

A billion people in the world eat rice, doesn't mean its particularly tasty or has much culinary clout - just that its cheap, simple, easily available food.
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by *catalyst » Sun Jan 17, 2010 11:58 am

I would like to preface this statement :

DJ Shadow, should never be heard speaking to an audience. He's terrible when ever his voice is broadcast.

It would appear the same in text form.

SHUTUP AND MAKE ME DANCE PLEASE.

Now,

I would say that the QUALITY of music, in the mainstream, has declined an INCREDIBLE amount since I've been listening to it. Old pop songs actually seem to be pretty reasonable as far as quality goes. The fact that you can tell them apart helps this a great deal.

The QUANTITY has gone up and up though, which to me draws an interesting parallel with the movie industry. Hollywood recorded some insanely high box office profit for 2009,(for a lot of shit movies) I believe it was in the ballpark of $10b. All this, while at the same time crying HIDEOUSLY poor with any number of ethically dubious/morally bankrupt litigious actions against file sharers.

And you'll never guess who the MPAA's partner in crime is : The RIAA.

This to me would indicate that the financial backers of mainstream media are going about it all wrong.

I do not know the solution to the problem the music/movie industry faces.

I also think the problem is the internet went VERY quickly from being somewhere you could do research / have cybersex to being pretty much an all inclusive rich-media delivery platform has caught a lot of people off guard.

At the end of the day though, I can't remember the last time I pirated music. I've downloaded bits and pieces that have been released for free but I generally buy it all online with a few records here and there.

Without any means for on demand movie content in a non-pirated sense I'll probably stick to my 24/7 on demand 'whatever-i-want and nothing-i-dont' video service in the comfort of my own home.
"Anybody want some motherfucking Earl Grey?" -Cleveland

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Sun Jan 17, 2010 12:14 pm

*catalyst wrote:the internet...... is an all inclusive rich-media delivery platform


I dont think it is, at all.

If you want to look at beautiful classical works of art, yes you can google image search them but you'd prefer to go to a gallery right?

If you want to see your favourite band live you can watch it on youtube, but you'd rather go to a concert right?

If you want your kids to learn algebra, you can show them a wikipedia entry on the subject or make them do some online classes.

Is that a substitute for real education, for curriculum, for one on one teaching? I dont think so.

The internet is a convenient medium putting people in touch with what they might like, its not an all-encompassing, all-inclusive solution for a better life or experience.
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by *catalyst » Sun Jan 17, 2010 12:41 pm

youthful_implants wrote:The internet is a convenient medium putting people in touch with what they might like, its not an all-encompassing, all-inclusive solution for a better life or experience.


Couldn't agree more. But I think the key word there is convenient. People soak that shit up and they'll put up with shit products/information just so they can have it.
McDonald's
Blockbuster
COUNTLESS IRISH PUBS...

Of course the internet isn't a replacement for 'the real thing' but people do like to listen to music or look at pictures or watch movies outside of a club, gallery or cinema.

I use the internet heaps, don't earn 'heaps' of cash and I manage to pay for things that I value. I buy video games, music, clothes, food etc. I value those things. I really think people just don't value some things which makes me wonder why they bother partaking in them at all...
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by Expert Knob Twiddler » Sun Jan 17, 2010 2:10 pm

storm in a teacup really. :roll:

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by FullGain » Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:00 pm

Expert Knob Twiddler wrote:storm in a teacup really. :roll:


original quote of the day! :lol:
just kidding round, ekt..........
I'll be back.


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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:34 pm

deviant wrote:http://labs.timesonline.co.uk/blog/2009/11/12/do-music-artists-do-better-in-a-world-with-illegal-file-sharing/

discuss


dont believe everything you read on the internet.
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by nic » Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:36 pm

Hypthesis
wtf all the graph colours are the same, thus making it difficult to analyse informations - even on a computer.

Method
old ghey imac

Conclusion
i conclude that funky j is a storm in his pwn teacup

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youthful_implants
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:20 pm

I think its very interesting but not really relevant to anyone actually trying to sell music in the current climate.

Being told its all good does not necessarily mean it is.
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deviant
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by deviant » Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:43 pm

you're just trying to cover up the fact that you are making buckets-o-cash now...

can I get a loan??????

:teef:

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almax
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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by almax » Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:47 pm

deviant wrote:you're just trying to cover up the fact that you are making buckets-o-cash now...

can I get a loan??????

:teef:


Don't you mean a rekkid deal?

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Re: A message from DJ Shadow...

Post by youthful_implants » Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:08 pm

deviant wrote:you're just trying to cover up the fact that you are making buckets-o-cash now...

can I get a loan??????

:teef:


haha I would but you still owe me 20 cents. you dont get rich by being generous you know.
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