Steve Bracks just quit politics.

[Lizkins]

Drew,

Don't take it personally dude, it's not me versus you. I've never seen our "history" as me versus you. You do your thing, I do mine, it's no big deal.

I'm all up for open debate on any topic. I couldn't care less what people think.

It wasn't one post that warranted the ban, though it was the straw that broke the camels back.

You don't see the PM's and MSN's from people asking me to ban you, to shut you down, to kick you off the site - and up until this morning, I have ignored them all.

Yes, members of the community, not me, time and time again have asked for you to be banned.

I don't take sides, but for one second imagine how hard it is for me to take action when 99% of the time I don't give a fuck.

Unfortunately I'm in a position where I have control over this site and when the members ask me enough times, I have to act. Which means people think it's "my personal agenda" and "I set my own rules", which is a load of shit - we run the site and we answer to the people. It's nothing to do with me - I couldn't give a fuck. It's just my name tagged on the administrators list which makes all eyes turn to me when something goes down.

So, in the mean time, take a break, cool off, and again - don't take it personally man - for goodness sake, you're wasting your time and energy on me.


Easy.

Agree totally.

Drew, i don't like half the stuff you say on here, but i haven't wanted you banned. Who wants to ban someone? but you have been out of line, and the complaints come through to the mods.

I know its hard for all, you think we (the mods) personally want to take people down over stuff, which is bollocks. I get mates telling me off for decisions that are made, and i was just doing my job as a mod. Not bitching about it, just stating facts.

If you chill out. We'd love to have you back. But enough of the slander towards others. You have threatened me in the past, and its fuckin not on. So just ease up.

[Polecat]

I was sad Bracksie was quiting. He's been in charge the whole time I have lived in Victoria!

[Spunko Novascrotia]

I wasn't going to post again, but Lizkins - 'threatened' you?
Are you serious?
I've never threatened, hit, or abused a female in my life,
Saying I've threatened you, is completely out of line.
Why just not call me a child abuser?
We've had our disagreements - one notable one, where you brought up a situation I had a few years ago in a club, on the net. Which really got me fired up.
And I shot you down in turn - but it was not uncalled for. And I felt bad about it afterwards, admittedly.
Please don't make me out to be some kind of monster.
I find your posts often times ill-informed and childish, and I sometimes wonder at your 'mod' status.
But, I would never launch a low blow at you like that.
Don't make accusations like that again. It's really, really stupid.
I'm far from a woman threatener.
As much as we disagree, please don't try to drag my name through the mud like that again - that hurt.
I can dig my own hole, if need be. I don't need cheap attacks like that to make matters far worse.
From waht I remember, whenever I've seen you out, I've been more than nice to you, and even comforted you a fair while back one night when you went through a break up?
Tried my best anyway.
Sheesh.

Lynt,
Dude. All well and good to make yourself out to be a saint now, after you've banned me - but please, lets be realistic here.
You, if anything were way more out of line than I have been lately. (in your post on the breaks thread)
Your banning me was completely personal. I can't see it any other way?
Do I need to post up the 'debate' on the breaks thread from a couple of days ago for emphasis??

Like I said. I'm happy to be banned. It doesn't bother me that bad. I think it reflects more on the site, and it's lack of free speech, than me just being myself - which I am hell proud of being.
But I'm not going anywhere scene-wise.
If anyone else wants to take a cheap shot. I'm sure karma will come back to bite you some day. It really is a gutless thing to do.
I'm not up for that. Never been one to kick someone while they are down.
And if you are, I truly feel sorry for you.

This banning is COMPLETELY unfounded. As Nic said, people who are complaining to mods about someone having a say - get real (thanx Nic - really appreciate waht you had to say).

To moderator botherers...
People have a different opinion/outlook to others. Deal with it, and leave the mods alone.
Or even better, confront the person in question via PM, or even better - to their face.
Would be better for everyone, and show some true integrity on your part.

In finishing...
If I decide to question the scene, or stick up for myself - then that's me.
If I put some people's noses out of joint for my honesty - then that's just too bad. Again, I make no apologies.
I thought we could all express ourselves on here? I thought that is what forum is all about? It may get heated at times, but as long as no-one is getting severely hurt, there's no need to ban.
I can be aggressive, if pushed, but I'd never do anything to intentionally hurt someone on here.
I'm me, I'll always be like this. And nothing is ever going to change that.

You tell me to chill out, and you'll let me back on.
I'm as chilled as chilled can be.
Again, I really didn't do anything that bad.
There's been much, much worse on here. It's obvious I've been singled out because I just don't hold back. So be it.
And from the amount of phone calls, sms's, emails, and support from people on here, that I never knew had my back. I think something needs to change. And it aint me.

[flippo]

[lynt]

Lynt,
Dude. All well and good to make yourself out to be a saint now, after you've banned me - but please, lets be realistic here.
You, if anything were way more out of line than I have been lately. (in your post on the breaks thread)
Your banning me was completely personal. I can't see it any other way?
Do I need to post up the 'debate' on the breaks thread from a couple of days ago for emphasis??

I can't stress it enough.

Don't take it personally. It wasn't a personal ban. I don't personally care what you say or do here - but - the members do, and we shall act for the majority.

My responses in the breaks thread from a few days ago were up to me to say. I said them, so what? I can say what I like just like anyone else on here, big deal? Because I have an administrator tag means I can't have an opinion? Because people have moderator tags means they can't have a debate?

We're not here to set examples man, we're here to keep the wheels in motion and keep it clean. Your argument that we aren't perfect moderators is a fruitless one.

Problem is: the post in this thread was the straw that broke the camels back dude, these complaints have been going on for too long, so its cool off time for a while until we can work this all out.

It's not a personal ban! OK?

[Spunko Novascrotia]

Straw that broke the camels back?
I haven't had a fight on here with anyone for weeks, months even - except you.
And even that was nothing that bad. Except when you maybe went just a bit over the top.

This is going to put a massive divide in the scene. As we both run in different breaks circles. Local and globally.
Because I aint going to change. And it's just so very wrong.
I think you banning me over something so minor, really reflects on you man.
Massive amount of people wanting me banned?
Please.
What am I Satan incarnate?:lol:
I've given my all for this scene.
Can anyone dispute that?
I'm blunt, argumentitive, and a smartarse sometimes. But I'm not a bad dude. I do what I feel needs to be done.
I'm fair, and I look after my friends as well as I'd look after myself.

But I tell you what....
This has inspired me to do what I do best - and get to it in a way I never have before.
I've done it before, and I'll do it again.

Watch me work.

[Lizkins]

Drew - yeah that was the argument. I didn't even out right say what was said in confidence, i alluded to it, apologise again for that though. But you did get aggressive and called me some harsh things in that argument. But whatever, not even the issue here, i was just saying what you have done in the past.

I just wanted that cleared up.


And i couldn't give a rats arse about whether you think i should be a mod or not. Some people like how i mod, and others prob don't. Clearly you are not happy with how this place is run, so be it, not everyone will be happy.



Good luck with everything.

[Snowie]

I hope it has trams. I really like trams - especially the really, really late ones, filled with Gestapo-like inspectors.

privatisation wasn't bracks's fault, even if he should've reversed it. now you're blaming busy roads on bracks, too? well done.

chronic underinvestment in public transport sucks arse, but if you think $2 billion in PT today means magically uncrowded trains and magically punctual trams tomorrow, then, well ...

I believe Foo's facetious reply began the argument. Just seems no-one can match LE's wit in heated discussion.

Banning Drew is not an answer to this. So OK he is outspoken/passionate about certain issues. Personally i would want a place where everybody is to afraid to say anything or challenge popular belief. From what i've just read on this thread, it is hardly even worth batting an eye idea over. Straw or no straw.

Drew should have the ban lifted.

[quick]

Banning is ghey... especially of someone who has quite a large impact on the REAL scene away from the internet, and who also has some very intelligent things to say...

And lets not forget Foo... who has been involved in many arguments and certainly likes to stir people to get a reaction... you can't ban the person for taking the bait...

[fooishbar]

And lets not forget Foo... who has been involved in many arguments and certainly likes to stir people to get a reaction... you can't ban the person for taking the bait...

for my part: no, i wasn't stirring to bait him, nor did i ask for the ban. (first i heard of it was when i woke up.)

in any case, it's not about this thread, it's about what's been going on since day.

[nic]

Hmm couldn't help but think (and post) that this is kind of like when mb went away for a bit because of 'bad vibes' and 'bullshit' but no one could say for sure what exactly was wrong?

How about the people who don't want drew here explain why? Rather than being this all seeing all knowing pissweak, mollycoddling silent majority?

All I see is people expressing support for him?

Banning anyone from a forum is juvenile really.

[FoundationStepper]

Bann all liberal voters i reckon

plenty of room on the herald sun comments pages for em

[ghetto kitty]

i found two more cents! >>

okay this seems like it has been compeltely been blown out of proportion, really!

everyone here has their own opinions, and their own way of putting them across,sometimes brutally honest, sometimes goading, sometimes blatant,
and quite honestly there ARE often a lot of conflicts on here that get passionate/heated.

BUT the difference between MB and say, ITM, or even my other online community (SR) is that the heated debates often remain about ideas and arent directed at an individuals life, choices or personality.
thats why they are often short lived, that why on the whole, this is a good place to hang out, to discuss music AND politics if need be, with a variety of like minded humans, people who share the same appreciation for the medium of music, if, perhaps, nothing else.

There is, luckily, people here who are not afraid to speak their mind, no matter how controversial. People who are brave enough to be themselves even with the anonymous abilties of the net. I consider myself one of them, cause my thirst for discussion an debate is often bigger then my urge for a pure 'reputation' , where aboslutely EVERYBODY likes me. (which is fucking impossible anyways)

anyone who calls it like it is, makes both many friends and many haters.
I know, hehehe.

This strikes a chord with me casue I was banned last year from my other online community/scene, one which i spent much time and energy in reality as well, cultivating and supporting.
I was reinstated after many many people casued dissent about the moderation of one of the scene's/site's most loved and hated but undeniably integral members.

There has been two people banned that ive known of since ive been here (a year and a half or so)
and they were harrassing and hijacking EVERY person, in EVERY thread, in an often offensive and very personal way.

mods > yes, evil walks a fine fucking line sometimes, often even.
but he is also an asset to us, to you!

and i for one, dont want to be scared of having my own opinions from watching our core members get banned for that reason.

no more beef, from either side, please?

[marcus]

Had a read of this thread, and I'd like to lend my support to Drew on this one. There was NOTHING in this argument which I believe validated banning him. Reading Fooishbar's post (and TBH I'm pretty much unaware of their previous conversations,) I would have read that as a bait on Drew - I think how Drew responded was to be expected - fair enough, I wouldn't expect anything less than him . Both are entitled to their opinion of what the subject of this thread, but the way Fooishbar quoted Drew was bound to provoke him.

All types of people contribute to this forum. Drew has not overstepped the line, no more than anyone else on this forum. Drew is passionate and vocal on his opinions, others may be more conservative, others may not say anything. Everyone is free to ignore what others say.

And on the subject of banning, compared to the banning of Factory Worker and Grey Son who delibrately spammed every thread, didn't contribute anything valuable to read and consider and who were generally just idiots, this doesn't even come close.

I think it would be a great shame not to allow Drew to contribute to threads as I think he makes a valuable contribution to this forum as a whole, and I personally know that a number of people who make up this community appreciate it.

[ulyssian]

!!! I liked steve sometimes. but i liked jeff to(o), except he nearly closed down my welfare service in favour of bigger services. Personally I should be the premier, prime minister and governor.... well.... maybe?! (Joan Kerner on the other hand killed my love for polka dots!!)

[kronz]

mods > yes, evil walks a fine fucking line sometimes, often even.
but he is also an asset to us, to you!

as do/are many of us!

I'd like to lend my support to Drew on this one. There was NOTHING in this argument which I believe validated banning him.

kids as uncle chop chop says harden the fuck up.


as uncle kronz says its the internet clam the fuck down and get over it its the internet. Lets just enjoy this place and have fun!!!!![/quote]

[Friday]

I totally support the decision to ban.

Many people have written here that LE is passionate and vocal about his opinions... That in itself would be fine. But when you attack other people in an aggressive nature to force your point, that is over stepping the line, and is something I have seen LE do time and time again.

Hopefully this ban can be a time out for LE to understand that people on here do not hate him and do not want him banned for personal reasons, but simply are not comfortable with the way in which he approaches his arguments with them, and often feel intimidated or harassed when they get into a discussion with him.

No one should have to feel that way when using MB.C. And I wholeheartedly support Karl in his efforts to remove the catalyst to protect the people who use this site from those sort of attacks.

I will not comment on the final argument that brought this to a head as it is really just one piece of a jigsaw of argument after argument involving you on this website.

LE you cannot deny that your approach to discussion can be a little forceful at times, and although I believe you have no malicious intent when asserting yourself in the way that you do, you do sometimes really offend and upset people. If you can find a way to still express your opinions, which are totally valid, in a way that doesn’t make other members feel persecuted, I would personally gladly welcome you back to the site. Until then though I think it is the right thing for you to no longer be part of MB.C

[sten]

I wholeheartedly support Karl in his efforts ... to protect the people who use this site from those sort of attacks.

tanx lynt i feel saif

[lilstormer]

I think the ban is lame

that is all

[Scotrod]

"But I tell you what....
This has inspired me to do what I do best - and get to it in a way I never have before.
I've done it before, and I'll do it again.
Watch me work."
Sounds good Drew. Maybe some time away from the computer will allow you to put all the advice you give so freely into practice.

[huge]

full support from me. quite a few times people have asked for at least an ignore button. it seems to me most of the time that LE just thinks this is a competition for the final (most witty) say. i couldnt for that.

[mecka]

quite a few times people have asked for at least an ignore button.

thatd make life a hell of a lot more easier around these parts.

[obliveus]

Drew makes this site more interesting IMO and his heart is always in the right place...though his wording in "debates" can be off settling at times. I definitely know how passionate he can be and we've had our problems in the past, but he is legitimately one the most sincere individuals I've met in Australia.

Like I always say, it aint my site to run. If ya'll want him banned, so be it. But this site is definitely NOT a better place without him. Then again, I'm quite happy having Spunko around again.

Vote for Little Evil!!!

[quick]

so... the mods all agree... well that settles it then... case closed.

[nic]

but steve there are so many well articulated arguments and much well presented heartfelt logic at work here


just a pity its all contradictory, weak, halfbaked, painfully self aware self congratulatory rubbish that serves no purpose but to....hmm no purpose really



get a fucking grip you bunch of whinging clowns

choke on cake and cough till your throat hurts!

ha!

[nic]

LOCK FENTS UP
he is making teh parody
lol fentoon

[Hardy]

NIC IN CAKE-CHOKING SHOCKER!!!! SOMEONE GET FUCKING NAOMI ROBSON OUT OF RETIREMENT...NOW!!!!

[mecka]

in before the lock.

[quick]

in before my cock

[fooishbar]

dear fentonator,
'scandal'.

love,
dannykins

[Lephrenic]

Anyway, back to Bracksy.

What exactly has Bracks done in his three terms?



Absolutely nothing.


It's ridiculous that someone who has been overwhelmingly voted into office with a huge mandate never used the opportunity for real reform. It goes to show there's nothing progressive about the Labour Party. They are simply there to keep the peace and not disturb business as usual.

you confuse me sometimes Hegsy

Too didactic? Sorry, I seem to have a habit of that.

But my post means what it says. While I'll always take Labour over Liberal, the real differences between the two are getting smaller every day. REAL CHANGE seems to only be offered by the Greens at present. I am not, nor will I ever be, a socialist.

Given this thread's recent controversy, I'm not here to argue or shout anyone down, just offering my opinion. I'll happily stand corrected if anyone can answer my question:

What has Bracks achieved for Victoria?

[Hardy]

in before my cock

'sif anyone gets in before your cock.

[quick]

in before my cock

'sif anyone gets in before your cock.

i got some people comin over so you better bend over... and sweep it up, just sweep it up...

[Hardy]

in before my cock

'sif anyone gets in before your cock.

i got some people comin over so you better bend over... and sweep it up, just sweep it up...

LOL! Pop'N'Lock Ness Monster FTW!!!

[fooishbar]

also, cake? not likely.

[Stray]

LOL!

[ulyssian]

Dippity bix.... do they still exist?

Rock EN role I say.... we gots bigger fish to fry shortly yessum!
(ok... i didn't really say that, the radio did dammit)

[nic]

LOL FOO
Its like you are pwning me all over again!

[fooishbar]

LOL FOO
Its like you are pwning me all over again!

i've got nothing to do with it, it's all about that pic (and the caption).

[Lizkins]

Anyway, back to Bracksy.

What exactly has Bracks done in his three terms?



Absolutely nothing.


It's ridiculous that someone who has been overwhelmingly voted into office with a huge mandate never used the opportunity for real reform. It goes to show there's nothing progressive about the Labour Party. They are simply there to keep the peace and not disturb business as usual.

you confuse me sometimes Hegsy

Too didactic? Sorry, I seem to have a habit of that.

But my post means what it says. While I'll always take Labour over Liberal, the real differences between the two are getting smaller every day. REAL CHANGE seems to only be offered by the Greens at present. I am not, nor will I ever be, a socialist.

Given this thread's recent controversy, I'm not here to argue or shout anyone down, just offering my opinion. I'll happily stand corrected if anyone can answer my question:

What has Bracks achieved for Victoria?

nah not too didactic. I was just shocked, cos you do go for Labour, as do i, and to state Bracksy hasn't done anything really shocked me.

I mean he recently has been getting the water issue in Vic sorted which for a politician to stand up and finally see a problem and actually DO something about it, i think is outstanding.

plus, Bracksy isn't at fault with public transport. The transport minster has a lot to answer for in that instance. Apparently many are vying (sp?) for her position cos she has so royally stuffed up.

[sneaky hands]

disappointed that LE is banned, i know the mods are simply acting on behalf of the community but its sad to see that the community is so fragile that someone like LE is not acceptable.

[Direkt]

Goodness me... teacup stylez and all!

An interesting thought is the fact that I doubt members PM mod's with constructive/supportive content, but only complaints.

It'd be interesting to hear how many people don't actually care too much about what has occured.

I know Little Evil has a quick and sharp tongue - but at the end of the day, it's just words - and it does make the board somewhat interesting IMHO...

[ghetto kitty]

disappointed that LE is banned, i know the mods are simply acting on behalf of the community but its sad to see that the community is so fragile that someone like LE is not acceptable.

so far it is only the mods who have said anything negative in public about him tho.

and lots of support from many members of said 'community"

[Stray]

His argument "style" rubs me up the wrong way most times.. but I wouldn't have him banned for it.

[CoB]

ive heard the name.. but have no idea who is was..
i hope he was bad! (cos he's quitting.. not cos hes been around for however long..)
im not good at saying words!

[Spherix]

i'd like to hear the unmastered version iwth the 2db shaved off plz, thx

[mixtress]

Spherix, that is the best signature to date IMO. Nais.


Ohhh Ed, you sounded like Dirty Harry just then



*hijackcomplete*

[mecka]

i had a rant typed out but it boiled down to this:

we very nearly lost this forum because people would simply heap shit on the mods, how about we all shut the fuck up and let them do their jobs - they're acting in OUR best interests.

edit: with the exception of one who i believe is unfit to be a mod altogether.

[mecka]

also, could somebody lock this thread, it has gone so far off topic its not funny and i don't think anything constructive is coming out of it anymore.

[Sustain]

ahh didn't this forum almost close down cos of this kind of bullshit?

most ppl dont want to read your essays and the agro is destructive.
i say if u got beef, take it to pm guys..

..hey whateva happened to agro? that crazy monster