SOMEONE PLEASE GIVE ME A HUG...

[obliveus]

OK, far from trying to bag some new form of technology, I want to know what all the DJ's think about Serato.

Constructively, if possible.

I know there was a thread kind of like this in the 'Production & Technology' section, but this thread is strictly for DJ's and what they think about it in the clubs. Serato has more to do with this music scene than just bedroom tech types, cuz so many peeps are using it now. Therefore, it deserves to be in 'The Music'.

So...

Do you use it?

If so, why?

The reason I'm asking is that I've seen it played so much as of late with some plays being rated highly and some being rated absolute shit.

Last Saturday I had a conversation with someone who just bought Serato, their reason being they could download all the music they dont really dig for free, or dirt cheap, thereby having the tunes to play gigs they wouldn't normally play with their vinyl, which is mainly hiphop, funk stuff. You know, all that new pseudo-electro-emo-bmore-rock-click-click-punk-hyphe-pop-reggaeton stuff I actually have nothing against, but wouldn't want to play it in a club...EVER!!! This decision of theirs was a financial one...they wanted more gigs and didn't have the records to play the gigs...so I wouldn't knock them for it, or any of you, as it's your life, and theirs, and you're the one to make your own ends meet.

This was coupled with an interview I heard on RRR, or PBS, earlier in the day. Mu-Gen was talking with someone about Serato and the new styles that have taken the clubs by storm. He said funk and hiphop no longer held a crowd like they used to and people wanted more elctronic soundz. Or something along those lines. He talked how he plays something like 11 gigs a week at just about everywhere, so honestly, he knows more about this than me...as I only average 1, maybe 2, a week...these being little hole in the wall places that I love, but are not the mammoth gigs Brett's on about.

So this got me thinking. Why are so many people buying and playing Serato? Nobody even try to tell me it's because it's less music to carry and "I got more rad tunes on one hard drive than 5 bags of vinyl" cuz I haven't seen a Serato DJ yet who plays the music I used to see them play or if they do, it's scaled way the hell down. I'm also not trying to be one of those, "Oh, the old days were so much better than today" type of people either, cuz half the stuff I play and am into has been produced within the last year.

But it seems to me that Serato, and I've made this statement on one of my My Space pages, completely takes the DJ out of the club element and puts them into searching through their hard drive for the next track. Rather than synching the beats up, cuz hey...it's already done for you, DJ's spend their time going through their programmed sets or groups of songs that go together...WITHOUT WATCHING THE DANCEFLOOR!!! Sure they can mix 85 tracks in 10 minutes, but do we need that? The only DJ I've seen who's rocked the house with Serato is Mu-Gen. Brett's just a DJ's DJ. I've seen a good Serato set at Revolver back room by someone I cant remember, but let's face it, who couldn't rock Revolver back room. It's like beating Bangledesh at cricket. More often than not, I see good Serato sets from dudes just playing background music to drinkers early in the night. Nothing fancy, just good tunes. Peak time sets just go too far over the top...most of the time. DJ's worry more about mixing a billion songs and lose the dancefloor. I've seen a few packed clubs...but dead, or quickly dying, dancefloors, as of late...Mu-Gen excepted. Like I said, I'm not out there enough...this is just my experience.

I think I come from a background that saw me become a record collector first, then finally play out, cuz I had so many fricken records. It was never about playing gigs for cash or anything like that. I just love music...always will. I cant be the only collector of vinyl on this site. I mean, I'll keep buying recs long after I've stopped DJ'ing.

I have nothing against Serato, but am looking for a little understanding. Am I that far behind in the times for not embracing this new technology in the clubs? Are my days as a club DJ going to soon be over cuz I'm not going the Serato route? Is my beloved funk, hiphop, soul, dancehall and assorted cheezy pop going to soon go the way of the dinosaur? Does my vinyl have a place in this music scene of ours?

Someone please give me a hug...

[marcus]

I suppose I've got a few things to say about it, and will some ideas out there...

Advantages:
*No need to lug around a record bag
*No need to change records or wait for a cd to load
*Can use hot keys on your computer to line up next tune
*Massive selection of tunes at your fingertips
*Cheap to buy new tunes with ($2 vs $20 for vinyl)
*Saves your precious classic vinyl from wear and tear
*Can usually replace your laptop (and hence tunes if you backed up) if you lose it, vs a lot of pain if you lose a record bag

Disadvantages:
*You need a laptop
*You need to take your very expensive laptop to gigs with you
*Your expensive laptop could be destroyed by some over zelous punter throwing beer all over it
*Having to fuck around setting up if club isn't "serato" enabled
*Limited to tunes which are available on MP3, or if they aren't you need to download a shit MP3/wav file which sounds like shit, or need to rip your tunes
*MP3's are cheap, meaning you don't put as much care into buying tunes anymore
*If you are cd/mp3 inclined, can't use special functions on CD player to do tricks
*You may be less inclined to go digging for tunes??? (not sure with this one, but a possibility)

To be honest, I think from a turntablists view who needs to play shitloads of gigs and needs the functionality of vinyl when playing, then yes it may be a worthwhile investment, otherwise for standard dj's keep playing vinyl or use cdj's.

[ghetto kitty]

im not a dj.

but i have something to say (as usual)

permission to speak OB1 ?

[deviant]

I love using serato... great system, very responsive, feels EXACTLY the same as playing rekkids.

Wouldn't buy as I an not a turntablist, or limited turntablist functionality required, CDs satisfy my mixing needs just fine. I have used it before (I borrowed my mates lappy/serato for a few weeks) and have played quite a few gigs with it.

I found it more hassle than it was worth, heeps of fuck-arsing around to set shit up/pack shit down before and ofter your set, not only annoying for you but the DJs playing before and after you. I also found that it DOES NOT and I repeat DOES NOT work very well on generator power.

I play with CDs pretty much 80% of the time with a few vinyls thrown in... with the exception of dubstep which is 95% vinyl. I still do not own CDJs which sux coz I buy tunes and only get to mix them at gigs..... I may buy serato and use it on my home PC to play on and record mixes, but wouldn't ever bother taking it out or buying a lappy. Even though it's expensive, it's still cheaper (if you take the lappy out of the equation) than 2 x CDJ1000s.

If a DJ is losing the floor and/or over complicating their sets because of it then I think they need to re-think why the DJ in the first place......... to play with toys, or to play good music and entertain people????

serato is a tool and just a valid a tool as any other. It's the attiude that you take to performing that makes the DJ.

The first ever serato set I saw was Amon Tobin (I know he used final scratch) and it was nothing short of amazing

[Snowie]

OB, i'll give you a hug in a non gay way, i'll give you a pile 7" and 12'' to cradle and hug. That will make you feel better. Vinyl will live for ever baby!!!

On way too many occasions i've seen serato crash leaving the dj scrambling to get it reloaded and working mid set. Very professional looking.

Again on way too many occasion i've seen serato, and even Laptop Ableton users, for the majority of their sets looking at the screen rather than interacting with their crowd. Farking BORING!!!!

IMHO, a good dj should be looking at the crowd, reading the room and generally hyping up a crowd. It honestly doesn't matter if you can bring half a year of music to a gig on your laptop, at the end of the day your only going to play propably less than 60 records in 3 hours, and that will fit in a record crate.

For all the geeky thin serato/ableton users.....GROW some muscles, it's propably the only exercise you get carrying a crate of records into a club.

What GK asking persission to speak....WTF...hehehe

[obliveus]

im not a dj.

but i have something to say (as usual)

permission to speak OB1 ?

Permission granted to ALL. Doesn't have to only be DJ's...sorry if I implied that.



BTW This is exactly the talk I was looking for...thanks!!!

[ghetto kitty]

I have nothing against Serato, but am looking for a little understanding. Am I that far behind in the times for not embracing this new technology in the clubs? Are my days as a club DJ going to soon be over cuz I'm not going the Serato route? Is my beloved funk, hiphop, soul, dancehall and assorted cheezy pop going to soon go the way of the dinosaur? Does my vinyl have a place in this music scene of ours?

In short OB1 > i think no.

Using albeton to play a whole set and staring at the screen IS boring, part of the 'entertainment' is TOTALLY the performance, and thats said as a punter/promoter/fan/deckslut/manager.

nicnac and i have been talking about this and i think Serato is a great tool, and some djs will choose to use it and do amazing things with it, and others will choose to use it and do really shit things with it, just like vinyl. just like the saxomophone.

The sound quality still isnt as good as vinyl, but technology seems to catch up and supercede itself doesnt it?
however the economic side of it can only be a good thing for djs right?

also, i think vinyl records also seem to have a different quality than any other 'tools of the trade', a romanticism, a passion beyond normality with most people who covet them. you, like many others will still revere them for what they are, will still buy and sell in small rickety shops and trade in hushed tones...

so to conclude...

entire laptop sets mostly suck ass
serrato could be mastered by some and butchered by others
its your choice what to use
vinyl will always be cool.

and for tonight, that is all.


oh > and the beer laptop thing > redundant. just gladwrap and go, saw it at a yurt party the other night. ;

[obliveus]

Need I say anymore than the hunt was on this weekend and I scored copies of 'Should I Stay or Should I Go?', 'Blame It On The Boogie', 'Stuck In The Middle With You', 'Endless Love' AND 'Dont Stop Til You Get Enough' (my third copy)? I dont need to mention the rest for fear of reprisals and massive drooling from Snowie. All scored in Daylesford, of all places, and not one was found in a 'record' shop. Just shows you gotta dig.

Diggin online sucks ass...but a neccesity nowadays. You need to be in the shops on a regular basis to fully appreciate the vinyl, but finding the shops is increasingly becoming harder which just makes the vinyl quest that much more rewarding, if you ask me. But it also means I can understand why peeps are buying online, a la Beat Port or other sites like that, and going straight to Serato.

My whole blast comes from the fact my mate bought Sorato strictly because it was the cheapest way to bolster his set with music needed to play all the new nights that play the previously mentioned music...not because he had some desire to push the boundaries. I love what I love too much to play anything just for a gig. Maybe I'm just selfish...I dont know.

Still...you cant hold a song you buy online until you rip it to CD and CD's dont come close to being as cool to hold as a gatefold vinyl copy of 'Electric Ladlyland'.

[Lephrenic]

Two things.

Firstly I have to say I find nothing particularly interesting in watching any DJ unless they're Q-Bert or something. Lights and lasers, projections etc are all great, but most times it's just a guy in a corner or sometimes on a stage playing one record after another. Big deal! People make such a fuss about laptop DJs but they're don't put the same visual expectations on vinyl DJs. IMO, vinyl DJs are just as fun and/or just as boring as any laptop DJ. Besides, if I like the tunes, I dance. Isn't that what you're supposed to do?



The other thing I want to say is this:

As a DJ, I am not there to make the punter look cool. That's what their overpriced sneakers and haircuts are for. I did not get into music to please Collar-up Rohypnol Boy. If punters think vinyl-playing DJs make a venue look cool and increase its cred (and thusly theirs by association), I couldn't care less. I will provide music via vinyl, CD or other digital means in the hope that people will enjoy the music as much as I do. If they don't like the look of me and my laptop, chances are they probably don't like the music either.

If DJs prefer vinyl for practical reasons or because they think it sounds better, I have no problem with that. Do what you prefer. But remember most new music is produced/recorded/mixed/mastered digitally before it finds its way onto vinyl. If you can genuinely tell the difference between CDs and vinyl in a blind test, I won't argue with you. At least you're listening, unlike Mr Keep It Real complaining about the lack of street cred in laptops and CDJs. I have no time for homeboy posturing.

[RK]

Well said Mr. Hegg!!

[Blaxter]

I like the hunt the records. Always been about the dust and the digging through crates. I stil love the smell of freshvinyl when you open a brnad new records bag up.

[system]

I suppose I've got a few things to say about it, and will some ideas out there...

Advantages:

• No need to lug around a record bag
• No need to change records or wait for a cd to load
• Can use hot keys on your computer to line up next tune
• Massive selection of tunes at your fingertips
• Cheap to buy new tunes with ($2 vs $20 for vinyl)
• Saves your precious classic vinyl from wear and tear
• Can usually replace your laptop (and hence tunes if you backed up) if you lose it, vs a lot of pain if you lose a record bag

Disadvantages:

• You need a laptop
• You need to take your very expensive laptop to gigs with you
• Your expensive laptop could be destroyed by some over zelous punter throwing beer all over it
• Having to fuck around setting up if club isn't "serato" enabled
• Limited to tunes which are available on MP3, or if they aren't you need to download a shit MP3/wav file which sounds like shit, or need to rip your tunes
• MP3's are cheap, meaning you don't put as much care into buying tunes anymore
• If you are cd/mp3 inclined, can't use special functions on CD player to do tricks
• You may be less inclined to go digging for tunes??? (not sure with this one, but a possibility)

To be honest, I think from a turntablists view who needs to play shitloads of gigs and needs the functionality of vinyl when playing, then yes it may be a worthwhile investment, otherwise for standard dj's keep playing vinyl or use cdj's.

i agree with the majority of those points (although serato is not an all digital or nothing interface), but for me the benefit is in also being able to play vinyl along with fresh new tunes in a digital format.

what you do with the system is up to you. i can see how it would encourage some to play through the latest compilations from beginning to end.

[system]

Need I say anymore than the hunt was on this weekend and I scored copies of 'Should I Stay or Should I Go?', 'Blame It On The Boogie', 'Stuck In The Middle With You', 'Endless Love' AND 'Dont Stop Til You Get Enough' (my third copy)? I dont need to mention the rest for fear of reprisals and massive drooling from Snowie. All scored in Daylesford, of all places, and not one was found in a 'record' shop. Just shows you gotta dig.

Diggin online sucks ass...but a neccesity nowadays. You need to be in the shops on a regular basis to fully appreciate the vinyl, but finding the shops is increasingly becoming harder which just makes the vinyl quest that much more rewarding, if you ask me. But it also means I can understand why peeps are buying online, a la Beat Port or other sites like that, and going straight to Serato.

My whole blast comes from the fact my mate bought Sorato strictly because it was the cheapest way to bolster his set with music needed to play all the new nights that play the previously mentioned music...not because he had some desire to push the boundaries. I love what I love too much to play anything just for a gig. Maybe I'm just selfish...I dont know.

Still...you cant hold a song you buy online until you rip it to CD and CD's dont come close to being as cool to hold as a gatefold vinyl copy of 'Electric Ladlyland'.

true, but all of those tunes are at least 25 years old now. there's nowhere near as many copies available anymore - hence the popularity of serato sratch and the ilk.

[same o]

STAY VYNIL...
serato dont sound as good, not enough bass...
but that is with ny digital format as it brings out the high end more..
but hey ob1 u dont play dub or dubstep.. so i guess it wouldnt really matter..
i dont think i could ever leave vynil, it's just to good

[Direkt]

There are MANY more products on the market than just just Serrato.

Serrato has just been around the longest - and has proven to be quite stable (if not only for the reason that it's quite limited).

It's kinda like calling mixers "Pioneers" IMO.

But... I'm certainly getting over forking out $20 for a tune, which I have to drive to a record shop to secure, and which with one scratch is ruined. And then I have to replace needles from time to time... Never thought I'd say that!

Having said that, if I was a cashed up individual, earning money from big gigs - I'd pick vinyl over digital. But I'm not... so it's vinyl for special purchases only these days.

[obliveus]

I guess it kind of comes down to, for me:

Are you a record collector who plays gigs with what you collect?

OR

Are you collecting the tools to play more gigs?

Does a builder collect 300 tools for his/her toolbox because they love having the tools or because they know they're going to need those tools to get the big building jobs?

I totally agree that DJ'ing is pretty fricken boring to watch, unless it's a turntablist, and even then, that gets boring if going for too long. Punters should be dancing, or chatting, or drinking...anyways. I really do care not for how a DJ "plays" a set, to each their own. If they want to use digital...go for it. But a few have actually told me that they foresee an end to vinyl...and they're selling up and buying Serato. This is what's on my mind:

Will my vinyl have a place in the club/music scene of Melbourne Town in the future? Will clubs stop buying/servicing turntables and just install a digital unit for ease with the DJ's playing with Serato and the like? These are real questions that vinyl semi-purists like myself have to take seriously as I dont want to go the digital route.

Cuz I aint selling up. My boys get my records one day, just like my dad gave me his. Maybe I'm too old fashioned. Too old. Dinosaur stylez.

BTW I bring my CD wallet out nowadays, too, mainly for Lounge sets. A good way to play all the stuff I aint found on vinyl...YET!

Thanks for the discussion folks...

[Brain]

I'll give up my vinyl only when they pry it from my cold dead hands. That is all.

[FoundationStepper]

script to everything hegg said.

i dont have serato, and i cant see myself ever getting into it for 'club' applications, purely becuase of the margin for fuckups and the setup issues. Id rather learn to be versatile on CDJS.

I borrowed serato to record a jungle set a while ago, just a home job - this was down to the fact the 80% of the tunes were killer unreleased tracks, and a few otherwise not available on vinyl. I wanted to be able to mix easily without having to fuck around with mouseclicks and midi pots in tracktor.

Was good to have handy, swapping betwen record and timcode vinyl. But i couldnt see myself buying it as really id rather just learn to be versatile with cdjs when playing out, and get my dubplate fix that way

id rather see someone mashing up (thier own+others) beats with a cool midi controller, headbangin and all, than a dj with records 95% of the time.

geez so many vinyl djs dont look up anyways - mix mix mix - yawn

[Brain]

PS. And here's ya hug ya big baby

[Scotrod]

I used to be a vinyl purist until I realised the only people that care are other vinyl purists.

[Hep]

IN VINYL WE TRUST!

so OB1 if people only wanna hear electronic music like brett said, does that mean we base our selection completely on the punters and what they are downloading from france?
the market dictating the product? this is gentrification if you ask me.lol.

serato....wont make a bad dj good, but it will make a good dj better.

[SoulWhiteMan]

I've said it before, I say it again

people who knock buying mp3s legitimately don't own decent cd decks

[Direkt]

people who knock buying mp3s legitimately don't own decent cd decks

All a matter of personal choice and perspective isn't it?

[mr lob]

firstly, i'll give you a hug OB1.

I can see the benefit of serrato, final scratch etc

However, for me part of the joy of being a dj is that I am a collector of vinyl and enjoy playing what I've collected, this includes lugging my 3 bags of vinyl to a gig.

I also don't play 11 gigs a week or have a radio show (which may help with getting said 11 gigs) but for the one gig I play a week in those small hole in the wall bars, I'm generally creating a feeling, generating a story, and that story is funk and the breaks and for me it is about using vinyl.

I don't want people to necessarily see me as the centre of attention, I'm not interested in those who can mix perfectly, I find this often times boring and lacking in inspiration, I definitely am ol skool because I don't want to always hear 85 songs in an hour, but a good song played through.

Like you this may be due to my age.

However, in whatever format you play, it's got to to be for what you've been booked for, it's about the crowd and watching them.

We as djs can't be everything to everyone but we can either bring them with us or not.

To me it's about the music and my personal choice is vinyl.

Let's hope that clubs don't do away with turntables and if they do we'll just play somewhere else.

Brett may have the experience, be a wicked dj and play more gigs than anyone, but there will always be peeps moved by the funk and hip hop breaks and always places that want to have them played.

Anyway that's my 2 cents...

[Sustain]

i love going into the a record store and talking about music, finding some mad tunes and going home to play them..

i also love finding that tune on vinyl that you've always wanted!

and waiting for that package to arrive on my doorstep... and getting home to find it

it's that true romance that you won't get from laptop djing.... plus it's boring to watch!!

[obliveus]

and waiting for that package to arrive on my doorstep... and getting home to find it

I got two coming in the mail at this moment. One is a 7" I paid $6 for, but the S+H is costing me $20. LOL!!! The price you pay and dammit if I'm not excited like a kid waiting for Santa.

[SoulWhiteMan]

people who knock buying mp3s legitimately don't own decent cd decks

All a matter of personal choice and perspective isn't it?

i used to by Vinyl vinyl vinyl vinyl vinyl vinyl 4life yo

then I realised I could save money if I had decent cd decks

bought some decent cd decks, collect music legally online,

never looked back.

As for people using computers and serato/torq in unimaginative, or non-entertaining ways, thats the users fault, not the software's

for instance who saw cut chemist at parklife 2006
scary good

[Direkt]

As for people using computers and serato/torq in unimaginative, or non-entertaining ways, thats the users fault, not the software's

For sure, and that sort of logic can be applied to turntables also - or DJ's/performers in general.

But, the fact of the matter is that not all of the virtual vinyl brands (Serato, Final Scratch, Torq, Virtual Vinyl etc) have the same features. So, whilst it's all well and good to be creative and imaginative - there actually are certain limitations to each program.

[almax]

All you people talking bout the DJ looking at the screen instead of the crowd, whats the fucking difference between looking for a track on a laptop to digging through a record bag?
Surely looking using a search engine would be quicker than finding a record out of its correct sleeve etc???

[FoundationStepper]

As for people using computers and serato/torq in unimaginative, or non-entertaining ways, thats the users fault, not the software's

For sure, and that sort of logic can be applied to turntables also - or DJ's/performers in general.

But, the fact of the matter is that not all of the virtual vinyl brands (Serato, Final Scratch, Torq, Virtual Vinyl etc) have the same features. So, whilst it's all well and good to be creative and imaginative - there actually are certain limitations to each program.

i dont understand that logic

surely the less features, the more close to vinyl djing it would be? or are you taklign about features that reduce the amount of screen diggin time?

[Blaxter]

Thread had potentional.

[Direkt]

As for people using computers and serato/torq in unimaginative, or non-entertaining ways, thats the users fault, not the software's

For sure, and that sort of logic can be applied to turntables also - or DJ's/performers in general.

But, the fact of the matter is that not all of the virtual vinyl brands (Serato, Final Scratch, Torq, Virtual Vinyl etc) have the same features. So, whilst it's all well and good to be creative and imaginative - there actually are certain limitations to each program.

i dont understand that logic

surely the less features, the more close to vinyl djing it would be? or are you taklign about features that reduce the amount of screen diggin time?

Okay, what I'm saying is that: sure, you can be as creative as you like with say Serato... but if Serato doesn't have all the capacity and functionality of say, Torq, then you're not just limited by your creativity. Functions I'm talking about include the ability to load in 3rd party effects etc etc.

Yes, the less functions - the closer to vinyl DJ'ing.
But if it's vinyl DJ'ing you're after - then DJ vinyl.

Does that make more sense mate?

[FoundationStepper]

But if it's vinyl DJ'ing you're after - then DJ vinyl.

no, becuase although i want the ability to dj/mix in a faimilar way (vinyl) i want to play music that isnt on vinyl. so why limit myself and what the audience gets to hear?

[Direkt]

Okay... but you just said "surely the less features, the more close to vinyl djing it would be?".

I think you're confusing what I'm saying - either that, or I'm confusing you.

If you've got less features, you ARE limiting yourself yeah? The interaction between turntable and user are the same amongst the different brands - it's just the actual feature set (I.e. loops, hotstarts, FX, fills, samplers, etc) that differ, and in turn - limit you in some regard (if you don't have them - that is).

[Blaxter]

Will read again.

[nic]

Thread had potentional.

Will read again, potential argument imminent

[FoundationStepper]

only if you adopt the position that using a "vinyl interface" to play records is limiting in a "performance" sense.

personally, i prefer to enjoy the potential in decks, mixer and offboard effects. im not so interested in 3rd party effects, an external delay and reverb is fine for me. im not interested in playing loops to make things blend really well, id rather try to find tracks that mesh together in interesting ways, and overcome the challenge of beat changes and vocal drops (eg in ragga jungle)

what is limiting for me is the choice of music you can play by sticking just with vinyl- as opposed limits on the party tricks you can pull off.

[Brain]

I play and love vinyl but really couldn't care less what other people play. Last year I saw z-trip play a brilliant set on serrato and vinyl. This year at Lucky Break Myagi played his set on ableton and it sounded great and he was jumping up and down like crazy having a great time, as was the crowd. Fort Knox Five played an awesome set at the Lounge this year using mainly CDs. DJs like Snowie can do amazing things on 2 or 3 decks using only vinyl. Will always have a soft spot for vinyl djs but in the end it all depends on who is playing not what they use.

[Direkt]

only if you adopt the position that using a "vinyl interface" to play records is limiting in a "performance" sense.

personally, i prefer to enjoy the potential in decks, mixer and offboard effects. im not so interested in 3rd party effects, an external delay and reverb is fine for me. im not interested in playing loops to make things blend really well, id rather try to find tracks that mesh together in interesting ways, and overcome the challenge of beat changes and vocal drops (eg in ragga jungle)

what is limiting for me is the choice of music you can play by sticking just with vinyl- as opposed limits on the party tricks you can pull off.

That's all well and good my man... but I'm sure there's someone out there who'd love to use those functions.

That's my point.

I don't use these programs - or advocate them. I've used them in the past, yes - but all I was saying is that all gear has certain limitations. Wether these effect you or not is another matter (I.e. - if you don't require all the bells and whistles, then more power to you!).

Just my 2c.

[same o]

id rather try to find tracks that mesh together in interesting ways, and overcome the challenge of beat changes and vocal drops (eg in ragga jungle)

so u mean u dont like beat matching????

[Blaxter]

Well spent Direktor.

[Direkt]

I think I've confused myself BS.

Time to decompress.

Chocolate time!

[FoundationStepper]

id rather try to find tracks that mesh together in interesting ways, and overcome the challenge of beat changes and vocal drops (eg in ragga jungle)

so u mean u dont like beat matching????

no

i dont like finding two predictable tunes that are so similar or otherwise linear they simply work together and run them together for ten minutes. theres whole genres that seem to be based around this style of mixing. yawn

id rather find two tunes that fit around each other with intersecting rhythms, and finding the possibly short time when they do so really well. its compositionally more interesting, and mroe challenging, hence more satisfying. for eg i like to mixing half time dubby broken beats in with jungle riddims and the like, and not just amens either

[lynt]

99% of people don't give a shit. 1% of people (aka this thread), do.

I know who I'm playing for, CD, vinyl, Serato, 1 dollar coin on an old tin can, if it works then do it.

No-one's dick is going to grow any larger in respect to how they play the music. *yawn*

[same o]

id rather try to find tracks that mesh together in interesting ways, and overcome the challenge of beat changes and vocal drops (eg in ragga jungle)

so u mean u dont like beat matching????

no

i dont like finding two predictable tunes that are so similar or otherwise linear they simply work together and run them together for ten minutes. theres whole genres that seem to be based around this style of mixing. yawn

id rather find two tunes that fit around each other with intersecting rhythms, and finding the possibly short time when they do so really well. its compositionally more interesting, and mroe challenging, hence more satisfying. for eg i like to mixing half time dubby broken beats in with jungle riddims and the like, and not just amens either

lol, so u like the sound of pots and pans falling out of a draw...
sorry mate, but it just sounds like u aint learnt how to beat match..
and there is heaps of shit u can do when u have to tunes in time, and it sounds good to.

[FoundationStepper]

listen, then comment

try the sock monster mixes: ibidem, mortar and pestle and avenge

until then your presumptious thoughts on what ive said are pretty irrelevant

if you dont like that music then well thats another matter - theres no accounting for peoples bad taste

[system]

so u like the sound of pots and pans falling out of a draw...

almost a direct quote from richie rich and mark james regarding jungle in 1994.

[Blaxter]

99% of people don't give a shit. 1% of people (aka this thread), do.

I know who I'm playing for, CD, vinyl, Serato, 1 dollar coin on an old tin can, if it works then do it.

No-one's dick is going to grow any larger in respect to how they play the music. *yawn*

what about getting a hard on whilst mixing?

[Scotrod]

99% of people don't give a shit. 1% of people (aka this thread), do.

I know who I'm playing for, CD, vinyl, Serato, 1 dollar coin on an old tin can, if it works then do it.

No-one's dick is going to grow any larger in respect to how they play the music. *yawn*

what about getting a hard on whilst mixing?

That's the secret......
There's no such thing as Serato. It's just dudes surfing for porn while playing old records.

[flippo]

so u like the sound of pots and pans falling out of a draw...

almost a direct quote from richie rich and mark james regarding jungle in 1994.

I think you might have got the wrong idea of what foundation meant there pete, but that asside.

best description I've heard of 'shit' Drum n Bass (you know the kind I'm talking about) is "people throwing spanners at mobile phones and car alarms"