is dubstep a derivative of techno?

This is the forum for all things Melbourne beats. Post your gigs and other Melbourne music related information here. Keep it about the music and music only, please keep on topic.
Post Reply
User avatar
SONUS
Posts: 170
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:39 pm

is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by SONUS »

It's a different beast, but peeps like Pinch do a nice line of dubstep-techno.

On a related topic, take a squizz at this Rob Booth mix where tech, dubstep & IDM all sit together in harmony.

[00] - Electronic Explorations Intro
[01] - Dopplereffekt - Speak and Spell
[02] - Cybotron - Clear
[03] - Autechre - Basscadet
[04] - Model 500 - Night Drive
[05] - Plasticman - Glob
[06] - DJ Misjah and DJ Tim - Access
[07] - Jeff Mills - The Bells
[08] - iTAL tEK - Bloodline
[09] - Vex’d - Killing Floor
[10] - Vex’d - Bombardment of Saturn
[11] - The Advent - Bad Boy
[12] - The Advent - Bad Boy (Planetary Assault Systems Mix)
[13] - Cybotron - Techno City
[14] - The Aztec Mystic - Jaguar
[15] - The Advent - Another Planet
[16] - Dave Clarke - Wisdom To The Wise (Robert Hood Mix) /Andy Stott - Ceramics
[17] - Phutre Pfantasy Club - Spank Spank
[18] - Leftfield - Storm 3000
[19] - Aaron Spectre - Say More Fire
[20] - Pangaea - Router
[21] - Datach’i - Twin Gant
[22] - Squarepusher - Tundra4 /West Street Mob - Breakdance (Electric Boogie)
[23] - Josh Wink - Higher State of consciousness (Shrink II Fit Re-Edit)
[24] - Photek - UFO
[25] - Milanese - Iacon
[26] - Rage Against The Machine - Wake Up
[27] - Bizzy B - Beats In My Head
[28] - The Suburban Knight - Infra Red Spectrum
[29] - Surgeon - Atol
[30] - Drexciya - Black Sea
[31] - Jeff Mills - Condor To Mallorca
[32] - Surgeon - Badger Bite
[33] - Pinch - Qawwali
[34] - Quark, Ruckspin & Planas - Miserere
[35] - Surgeon - Whose Bad Hands Are These (Roly Vex’d Remix)
[36] - Burial - Gutted
[37] - Loefah - Mud
[38] - Milanese Vs Virus Syndicate - Dead Man Walking
[39] - Datach’i - Ed’s Head
[40] - Mount Kimbie - Maybes /Dave Clarke - No Ones Driving /King Cannibal - Aragami Style
[41] - Funki Porcini - King Ashabanapal Pt II
[42] - Philip Glass - Heroes (Aphex Twin Remix)
With techno luminaries like Villalobos, Luciano and Surgeon collaborating with some of dubstep’s finest producers, as well as playing tracks from the fast emerging scene in their sets, it’s little surprise that names like Headhunter, Skream, Shackelton, 2562, Pinch and many others are releasing a distinctly techno infused take on dubstep. The convergence between these genres seems a logical progression. This new strain harks back to the early techno experiments of Basic Channel and the resulting minimal and dub-techno aesthetic. For many, dubstep would not be the same without the influence of techno.

One of the main protagonists in this distinctive sound is Headhunter, who hails from Bristol. It is widely considered the spiritual home of dubstep, and a city that has its own unique take on the sound which is now going global. With artists such as Pinch, Peverlist, RSD and fellow label mates 2562, Appleblim and Martyn, Headhunter is considered a visionary. He has long occupied his own particular niche of the dubstep scene, sitting comfortably between the ultra heavy bass styles of Skream, Benga and his Tempa label mates, and the deeper Berlin influenced Bristol side of the dubstep coin.

With two EPs released on Tempa and a string of remixes of producers such as Martin Buttrich, Brendon Moller and Antix – the winter of 2008 saw Headhunter release his long anticipated debut album. Nomad was widely considered as one of the defining albums in the genre for 2008. Now Headhunter is making his way to Australia for the first time, playing shows in Sydney, Melbourne and Perth. We can’t wait.

Your sound is commonly described as mixture of techno and dubstep, is this a reflection of your DJ sets as well?

My music has been closely related to techno and it’s never unusual for me to drop the odd techno track in my sets. I think the two sounds go hand in hand so it’s very common for me to represent both genres in my beats and DJ sets. In saying that, my beats are influenced by a lot of genres, from psy-trance to breakbeat and early drum and bass. I would hope all of that comes across in my music and when I play. It’s very exciting to touch new territory with my music, I can’t wait to play in Australia.

How has you early interest in drum and bass shaped your current work, do you think it is a relevant as it was in the 90s?

I am still influenced by drum and bass, amongst many other sounds. When I was younger I was more interested in the early hardcore breakbeat sounds of the early 90s, and then into techstep DnB when it evolved into that. Stuff like Ed Rush and Optical, and Photek, he used spaced out sounds and a lot of atmosphere, I used to think that stuff was from another planet. DnB died for me though, it started repeating itself in a bad way. I got into psy-trance for a while, or ‘doof’ as you guys call it! Actually I still like it, a lot of its pretty samey and goes nowhere, but the real twisted and deep stuff from the UK, Sweden, Norway, Denmark and France is great. Production-wise I think it’s one of the most underrated and looked down upon genres. It had great energy, good atmosphere and the parties are pretty impressive, I’ve never seen décor like that of a psy-trance party.

Dubstep has certainly made its mark in terms of wobbly basslines and in some cases reggae and dub influences, but for Bristol and much of Berlin the techno element has taken the sound in a new direction. How did this come about for you?

It’s funny you know, I’m more influenced by psy-trance than techno. I do really like the whole Berlin dub techno sound too, I’m just a whore for good music I think, and when I hear something I like I try and find out as much about it as possible. Generally, anything synthey and futuristic inspires me, like Detroit or Blade Runner. But, I try not to literally take on the genres as influences. For instance, you do here some wobble in some tunes, others not so much. I take bits of everything I like and make them my own.

Your album Nomad was considered one of the best of the year. It must be flattering given some of the albums that came out in the scene during 2008. Also, to release on an album as prestigious a label as Tempa must haven been exciting?

It was great to get the album out after the hard work it took creating it, but now that everything has settled I feel ready to do newer stuff. Recently I’ve made a few tunes that are a lot more dancefloor orientated. But yeah, to release on Tempa is great, I really can’t imagine another label looking after me like how Tempa has. Tempa is a massive label and they have a huge catalogue of amazing artists, so to be a part of that family is a great privilege. I’m certain if I was signed to another label I wouldn’t have had as many opportunities.

Any plans for your follow up album?

No immediate plans for a second album. Nomad was hard work and I am still recovering from it, but I do have some forthcoming material on Tempa and some other key labels in the scene that will be kept under wraps for now. A few remixes of tunes on my album are coming from some very high profile producers. A lot of my time has been spent sorting out my live audio-visual set. Its still early days for this but a quick look on my blog will show you what we – me and my visual artist, Alex – did in Belgium recently. It’s something new and exciting and has a lot of potential for growth.

What can we expect from your sets in Australia? Do you know much about the scene here?

What I do know is that more and more UK artists are playing there, so something must be going right, apart from that I guess I will find out soon enough. Musically I do know of Spherix, a great producer. I’ve been playing his stuff for a good while now. He’s got a real deep sound that’s been a mainstay in my sets. Looking forward to checking your country out!

What do you think?

Discuss/
Image
Lephrenic
Posts: 3494
Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2004 10:57 pm

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by Lephrenic »

I wouldn't say so.

IMO many of these genres are spawned in fairly closed circles. For example, Burial had never heard Pole or Basic Channel, despite their music's similarities.

Not to say that they're conjured from thin air - it's hard to argue that any music with an 808 bassline doesn't owe a lot to techno. Outside influences are always there in some form.

But fundamentally it's the long tradition of bass heavy music in the UK (garage, jungle, going right back to reggae) to which dubstep owes the most, far more than the music of Detroit or Berlin, which itself owes so much to reggae/dub.
User avatar
deviant
Posts: 18213
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 6:52 pm
Location: couch
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by deviant »

2562 states that Detroit is one of his biggest influences.
Lephrenic
Posts: 3494
Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2004 10:57 pm

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by Lephrenic »

That's not the point. Loads of techno guys have gotten into dubstep, but it's always after the fact. Techno may have been an influence but it came into the mix gradually, whereas reggae and dub was in there from the beginning.
User avatar
aroes
Posts: 2131
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:33 am

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by aroes »

It just occured to me that drum and bass evolved in a similar way
In the beginning it was all ragga influenced skank out party vibes, then the 'tekstep' sound came along, which borrowed heavily from dark techno
Dubstep has been an established genre for about 5 yrs now, which is about how old jungle was before it began to morph into the many subgenres that exist today

So basically, dubstep won't have come full circle until there is a 'dubstep band' that can fill a stadium, get commercial airplay and land a gig on the big day out




:teef:
User avatar
flippo
Posts: 6277
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2004 7:21 pm
Location: Catnip
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by flippo »

DNA test?
Expert Knob Twiddler
Posts: 303
Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:09 pm

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by Expert Knob Twiddler »

flippo wrote:DNA test?
now there's a plan!
User avatar
fooishbar
Posts: 8660
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:56 am
Location: there and/or elsewhere

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by fooishbar »

Lephrenic wrote:But fundamentally it's the long tradition of bass heavy music in the UK (garage, jungle, going right back to reggae) to which dubstep owes the most, far more than the music of Detroit or Berlin, which itself owes so much to reggae/dub.
sound system culture gets mugged by dark garage in a back alley, end of.

leigh knows tings.
myspace / too much! / photos (flickr) / photos (tumblr)
aroes wrote:promising, but lost me at offensive mid range snarl
kava
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2008 9:27 am
Location: wgtnNz

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by kava »

why do idiots argue over this anymore? good tune is good tune
User avatar
youthful_implants
Posts: 4379
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: bracken
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by youthful_implants »

all electronic music is a derivative of techno. end of thread. ;)
Strontium Music

Image

SOUNDCLOUD | FACEBOOK | TWITTER | TUMBLR
User avatar
aroes
Posts: 2131
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:33 am

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by aroes »

NO
User avatar
youthful_implants
Posts: 4379
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: bracken
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by youthful_implants »

-aroes- wrote:NO
Yeah but no but yeah it is though IMO.

The Dubstep I like, owes less to dub than it does to any other form of dance music I can think of.

I feel like I outgrew Dub as a format a long time ago, as it just got massively monotonous and the Dub scene in London was full of crackheads and not very friendly.

I should add that Dub in itself generally speaking and in my opinion is an extremely limited and contextually boring musical medium. Its not that I dont like it, I love it, but comparatively to other genres it lacks scope, musical ingenuity and ambition.

I think Dancehall, Bashment, Soca and Reggae actually have a much richer tapestry to offer.
Strontium Music

Image

SOUNDCLOUD | FACEBOOK | TWITTER | TUMBLR
User avatar
Direkt
Posts: 15205
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:38 am
Location: The Voir
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by Direkt »

Lephrenic wrote:it's hard to argue that any music with an 808 bassline doesn't owe a lot to techno
Rap/hip-hop?
User avatar
same o
peteybear™
Posts: 9505
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:22 pm

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by same o »

flippo wrote:DNA test?

fucken lol
User avatar
nic
Posts: 11184
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:12 pm
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by nic »

yeah i guess breaks came from people sampling old funk breaks like james brown funky drummer, speeding them up and adding techno / electro / dub / like elements. its the massive pool of influence breaks draws on that makes breaks such a good and varied genre.

i think its safe to say dubstep owes alot to breaks and was invented for people who wanted the faster tempo breaks stuff with a more sparse bass driven sound, some dudes took the techno bits, some the dub bits, some the garage bits, and none the breaks bits. then rusko made cockney thug and the whole argument accidentally.
User avatar
same o
peteybear™
Posts: 9505
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:22 pm

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by same o »

:smt005
User avatar
fooishbar
Posts: 8660
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:56 am
Location: there and/or elsewhere

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by fooishbar »

youthful_implants wrote:I should add that Dub in itself generally speaking and in my opinion is an extremely limited and contextually boring musical medium. Its not that I dont like it, I love it, but comparatively to other genres it lacks scope, musical ingenuity and ambition.
your scholarly analysis is beyond reproach.
myspace / too much! / photos (flickr) / photos (tumblr)
aroes wrote:promising, but lost me at offensive mid range snarl
User avatar
flippo
Posts: 6277
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2004 7:21 pm
Location: Catnip
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by flippo »

are sandwiches a derivative of ham?
Last edited by flippo on Mon Mar 16, 2009 12:45 pm, edited 4 times in total.
User avatar
nic
Posts: 11184
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:12 pm
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by nic »

flippo used to like breaks, he had an awsome lawgiverz cd. bass instinct maybe?
its influenced his production style no end imo.
User avatar
fooishbar
Posts: 8660
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:56 am
Location: there and/or elsewhere

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by fooishbar »

flippo wrote:are sandwiches are a derivative of ham?
i lol'd. well played sir.
myspace / too much! / photos (flickr) / photos (tumblr)
aroes wrote:promising, but lost me at offensive mid range snarl
User avatar
youthful_implants
Posts: 4379
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: bracken
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by youthful_implants »

fooishbar wrote:
youthful_implants wrote:I should add that Dub in itself generally speaking and in my opinion is an extremely limited and contextually boring musical medium. Its not that I dont like it, I love it, but comparatively to other genres it lacks scope, musical ingenuity and ambition.
your scholarly analysis is beyond reproach.
ah thank you.

a lot of the new stuff coming from Reso and 16 Bit et al is so tech-oriented is a bit like the halcyon days of 90s Drum n Bass when Tech-Step was huge think Ed Rush and Optical, Stakka and Skynet etc.

So I'm very very excited about that, because I used to love Tech-Step hard and it kind of fizzled out probably due to being too girl-unfriendly or something.

Big tings gwan either way. :blob6:
Strontium Music

Image

SOUNDCLOUD | FACEBOOK | TWITTER | TUMBLR
User avatar
fooishbar
Posts: 8660
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:56 am
Location: there and/or elsewhere

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by fooishbar »

flippo wrote:are sandwiches a derivative of ham?
myspace / too much! / photos (flickr) / photos (tumblr)
aroes wrote:promising, but lost me at offensive mid range snarl
User avatar
nic
Posts: 11184
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:12 pm
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by nic »

speaking of 16bit witnessed teh rave impact of this at rythm factory last month and concluded that 16bit are also breaks.
the back room had a 'nang' bar that sold only balloons (no drinks). 3 baoons for a fiver. :smt007

Watch the posted video on YouTube.

User avatar
deviant
Posts: 18213
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 6:52 pm
Location: couch
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by deviant »

speaking of 16bit, they make some of the most horrible music I've ever heard..... I like it though, just in small doses.
User avatar
nic
Posts: 11184
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:12 pm
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by nic »

lol can get pretty mid range buzzy at times, kills raves good.
User avatar
youthful_implants
Posts: 4379
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: bracken
Contact:

Re: is dubstep a derivative of techno?

Post by youthful_implants »

nic wrote:lol can get pretty mid range buzzy at times, kills raves good.
+10 points for future dubstep affiliation prediction btw.
Strontium Music

Image

SOUNDCLOUD | FACEBOOK | TWITTER | TUMBLR
Post Reply