Shapelle

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:02 pm

SoulWhiteMan wrote:
tiggus85 wrote:
SoulWhiteMan wrote:death to indonesia

we win in the end
the capatalist market economy will see these muthafuckers exploited until hell freezes over.
Even though I'm going to do honors in Anthropology, I really don't give a fuck. Let the litte fuckers grow rice and make a dollar a day until hell freezes over.
your a racist dick
I wasn't until I saw this verdict.
That is precisely my point.
I'm trying to highlight the negative impact this will have.
My posts were deliberately "over the top"
I don't genuinely feel this, I'm trying to (use myself) to highlight a point.

it's a lame way of sharing your viewpoint.

There has always been a negative point with Indonesia. It's not really my #1 holiday choice. It's only been a viable holiday destination because of it's cheapness for most western holiday makers.

I thought terrorism there was the most negative aspect _not_ to go there. not from this case.

RMHC · Post by **RMHC** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:03 pm

shepherd · Post by **shepherd** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:07 pm

SoulWhiteMan wrote:this is drawing up so much emotion in me, if I had the resources I'd smuggle arms and coke into the country, start a militia group and overthrow the whole fucking legal system, CIA style!!!!

why do people think she's innocent?? i've never understood it. her defence was weak as piss.

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:07 pm

tiggus85 wrote:sorry mate, but there are far more important issues Australia has with indonesia than the plight of a few very stupid Australians... if this is used by the Howard gov to go on another neo-colonialist attack to score votes at home, then i will be very pissed off...

I think australian tax payers have already made that decision.

Direkt · Post by **Direkt** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:08 pm

I feel sorry for her (I don't think she did it)... hopefully her appeal sees this overturned...

Fents · Post by **Fents** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:09 pm

20 YRS

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:10 pm

shepherd wrote:
SoulWhiteMan wrote:this is drawing up so much emotion in me, if I had the resources I'd smuggle arms and coke into the country, start a militia group and overthrow the whole fucking legal system, CIA style!!!!
why do people think she's innocent?? i've never understood it. her defence was weak as piss.

prosecution was weak as piss too. It was all heresay, and nothing was done to determine without reason of a doubt that the drugs were hers.

Posession is the thing that Indo court system looked at mainly. screwed either way.

Direkt · Post by **Direkt** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:10 pm

shepherd wrote:
SoulWhiteMan wrote:this is drawing up so much emotion in me, if I had the resources I'd smuggle arms and coke into the country, start a militia group and overthrow the whole fucking legal system, CIA style!!!!
why do people think she's innocent?? i've never understood it. her defence was weak as piss.

Coz why would u take 4kg of weed from Oz to Bali (and not the other way around).... Just doesn't add up mate, how much is she gonna make off that? Just my point of view - but if that was an intentional drug-run - it was farkin stupid!

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:11 pm

everything is circumstantial...you guys realise the bali 9 run was done on the exact same day as schapelle entering the country. food for thought.

shepherd · Post by **shepherd** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:11 pm

not true direkt.

this case is full of myths and half truths.

she could have made about 120k off that bag if she had of got through customs.

why it stirs up so much emotion is beyond me. i guess australians always side with the underdog - regardless of their actions.

LÃ³s Kasinoâ€” · Fri May 27, 2005 3:15 pm

i just hope this doesnt unleash an anti-indonesia mentality for those who believed her to be innocent !

i repect Indonesia for unholding their dignity !

however now they will just look powerless when the prisoner-transfer scheme is implemented...

Fents · Post by **Fents** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:15 pm

Rob M wrote:everything is circumstantial...you guys realise the bali 9 run was done on the exact same day as schapelle entering the country. food for thought.

For every one drug bust another 4-5 get through innit?

Hardy · Post by **Hardy** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:16 pm

valuetime wrote:dude, you gotta respect other countries' laws and shut the fuck up.

Fuck oath. Everyone knows that different countries view the severity of drugs differently, and if you get busted in smuggling drugs in Indonesia, they are going to fuck you up.

The solution: DON'T SMUGGLE DRUGS MORON!

Yes, it's a harsh sentence, but them's the breaks.

Guyno · Post by **Guyno** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:17 pm

Direktor wrote:
shepherd wrote:
SoulWhiteMan wrote:this is drawing up so much emotion in me, if I had the resources I'd smuggle arms and coke into the country, start a militia group and overthrow the whole fucking legal system, CIA style!!!!
why do people think she's innocent?? i've never understood it. her defence was weak as piss.
Coz why would u take 4kg of weed from Oz to Bali (and not the other way around).... Just doesn't add up mate, how much is she gonna make off that? Just my point of view - but if that was an intentional drug-run - it was farkin stupid!

Actually Spies that's what I thought but apparently no emphasis was placed on this because it isn't true. Apparently good gear is in big demand with big bucks being paid for it especially amongst the tourist party scene.

Many people have been convicted bringing dope into the country. Suprised me too.

Direkt · Post by **Direkt** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:17 pm

Yeah - well that may be true mate, I guess I don't really know. Maybe she did, maybe she didn't... Maybe she could make 120k there (that's alot of money for weed!), but how much could she make here - and w/out the stresses of border checks???

I guess I'm a bit undecided now....

LÃ³s Kasinoâ€” · Fri May 27, 2005 3:18 pm

would be sweet if the "drug bag-planter" revealed him/herself out of guilt !

shepherd · Post by **shepherd** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:21 pm

that assumes that person exists ticka?

you can't really take the words of a convicted rapist with too much cred can you ...? especially when it's vague and more harm than good.

Feigan · Post by **Feigan** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:21 pm

not sure if anyone has seen it yet but she got 20 years

Direkt · Post by **Direkt** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:25 pm

Feigan wrote:not sure if anyone has seen it yet but she got 20 years

i believe that's what we are discussing, my learned friend...

Fents · Post by **Fents** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:26 pm

Fents wrote:20 YRS

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:28 pm

shepherd wrote:that assumes that person exists ticka?

you can't really take the words of a convicted rapist with too much cred can you ...? especially when it's vague and more harm than good.

bad analogy. schapelle has no convictions or recorded history of crime. In this situation you can err on the side of schapelle's case.

Even if she did import the drugs in, and had an opportunity to scope the system out during her previous trips to bali -- it goes without saying that evidence should've been analysed a lot further, and this is where aussies have cause for concern in terms of going through proper judicial approach.

It's a clash of 2 different systems. word against word. There was no visual evidence, just heresay. hardly a defensive case you can build on if everything is working against you, and you have no concept of another countries judicial process.

flippo · Post by **flippo** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:29 pm

guilty or not, I'm suckin down a fat one for her 2nite

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:32 pm

flippo wrote:guilty or not, I'm suckin down a fat one for her 2nite

ahh the philosophical approach. werd. so is life.

valuetime · Post by **valuetime** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:32 pm

Rob M wrote:There was no visual evidence, just heresay. hardly a defensive case you can build on if everything is working against you, and you have no concept of another countries judicial process.

there was 4kg of evidence! there was no evidence (except hearsay) that she was innocent. and i'm sure her lawyers knew exactly how the courts worked.

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:38 pm

valuetime wrote:
Rob M wrote:There was no visual evidence, just heresay. hardly a defensive case you can build on if everything is working against you, and you have no concept of another countries judicial process.
there was 4kg of evidence! there was no evidence (except hearsay) that she was innocent. and i'm sure her lawyers knew exactly how the courts worked.

exactly, did they take dna, finger printing, plastics analysis, determination of weed origin, baggage weight, video evidence of opening of bag, customs documentation of declerations.

The judges relied on customs officers 'word' in a court of a law, and dismissed witnesses (other aussie travellers) willing to speak at the court about their count of events.

like i said before. Indonesia doesn't seem to give a toss about this, just posession and testimonials from officials that witnessed the events that unfolded. and that seemed to be good enough for the judges and their own constitutional bounds. a damn shame really.

mecka · Post by **mecka** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:47 pm

I'm tired of hearing all the crap about this. No offense but what implications could this possibly have on the Australian population at large, the relationship between Australia and Indonesia, or any of you lot?

There are countless other people who've been arrested for drug smuggling in Indonesia, but NONE of them garner the same attention as this idiot does. Why? Boobs is why. Constant protestations of innocence is why. Having a goddamn media circus is why.

I am so fucking over it.

Take her out on a beach at dawn to be shot or let her rot in a cell or even let her go.

I couldn't give a fuck.

valuetime · Post by **valuetime** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:53 pm

Rob M wrote:like i said before. Indonesia doesn't seem to give a toss about this, just posession and testimonials from officials that witnessed the events that unfolded.

agreed. but that's how their system has always worked. it's not perfect, but ours sure as fuck isn't either. i just don't think it's surprising or controversial.

from their perspective, any high profile defendant has to get the book chucked at them, otherwise its not zero tolerance. whether or not countries should have zero tolerance for anything, or whether narcotics should be illegal are the interesting debates, imo.

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:56 pm

mecka wrote:I'm tired of hearing all the crap about this. No offense but what implications could this possibly have on the Australian population at large, the relationship between Australia and Indonesia, or any of you lot?

It means that given any situation that may arise for a traveller who is found liable for an illegal act, that the judicial system of that governing country doesn't adhere to a proper recourse to determining guilt.

How would you feel if knowing full well the judicial process to a circumstancial case that resulted in your guilt was totally wrong?

Society judges you for your acts with a jury, Indonesia is not Schapelle's society, she had no jury. her crime was an injustice whether she be innocent or guilty!

The princple at hand is the appropriation of justice. and this to me hasn't been served. I'm not really a for or against schapelle. I'm for a fair and equitable system that works on a global scale.

valuetime wrote:
Rob M wrote:like i said before. Indonesia doesn't seem to give a toss about this, just posession and testimonials from officials that witnessed the events that unfolded.
agreed. but that's how their system has always worked. it's not perfect, but ours sure as fuck isn't either. i just don't think it's surprising or controversial.

from their perspective, any high profile defendant has to get the book chucked at them, otherwise its not zero tolerance. whether or not countries should have zero tolerance for anything, or whether narcotics should be illegal are the interesting debates, imo.

It's true, our system isn't perfect. but nothing is. The aim of this and many other cases should be to highlight the inequities and bloody fix them. That's what society building is imo. It's like a marriage. for better or worse.

If we were all enlightened as 'some' say they are, there would be stuff done about your views of point. all talk, but no action.

Feigan · Post by **Feigan** » Fri May 27, 2005 3:57 pm

oops - note to self

read posts before posting

calstro · Post by **calstro** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:03 pm

Feigan wrote:oops - note to self

read posts before posting

Nah don't bother...

Just post randomly about anything, anytime....

shepherd · Post by **shepherd** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:04 pm

so who's going into business with me - i just trademarked 'FREE SHAPELLE'

I'm rich biatch!!

dust · Post by **dust** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:10 pm

Rob M wrote:
shepherd wrote:that assumes that person exists ticka?

you can't really take the words of a convicted rapist with too much cred can you ...? especially when it's vague and more harm than good.
bad analogy. schapelle has no convictions or recorded history of crime. In this situation you can err on the side of schapelle's case.

Even if she did import the drugs in, and had an opportunity to scope the system out during her previous trips to bali -- it goes without saying that evidence should've been analysed a lot further, and this is where aussies have cause for concern in terms of going through proper judicial approach.

It's a clash of 2 different systems. word against word. There was no visual evidence, just heresay. hardly a defensive case you can build on if everything is working against you, and you have no concept of another countries judicial process.

Nah, what I presume Shephard means here is that the defence flew over a convicted rapist to give evidence that 'someone' admitted to him that he knew the person who smuggled the weed in Shapelles bag. Very dodgy I think, it wouldn't take much encouragement to make a convicted man testify like that. The guy wouldn't name names and the 'evidence' was thrown out.

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:11 pm

calstro wrote:
Feigan wrote:oops - note to self

read posts before posting
Nah don't bother...

Just post randomly about anything, anytime....

t-shirt: I went to indonesia and pope benedict didn't give a toss I converted.

Feigan · Post by **Feigan** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:11 pm

Random is the way to go

the cat said "I enjoy taking walks on the beach under a moonlit sky"

Rob M · Post by **Rob M** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:12 pm

dust wrote:
Rob M wrote:
shepherd wrote:that assumes that person exists ticka?

you can't really take the words of a convicted rapist with too much cred can you ...? especially when it's vague and more harm than good.
bad analogy. schapelle has no convictions or recorded history of crime. In this situation you can err on the side of schapelle's case.

Even if she did import the drugs in, and had an opportunity to scope the system out during her previous trips to bali -- it goes without saying that evidence should've been analysed a lot further, and this is where aussies have cause for concern in terms of going through proper judicial approach.

It's a clash of 2 different systems. word against word. There was no visual evidence, just heresay. hardly a defensive case you can build on if everything is working against you, and you have no concept of another countries judicial process.
Nah, what I presume Shephard means here is that the defence flew over a convicted rapist to give evidence that 'someone' admitted to him that he knew the person who smuggled the weed in Shapelles bag. Very dodgy I think, it wouldn't take much encouragement to make a convicted man testify like that. The guy wouldn't name names and the 'evidence' was thrown out.

ahh sorry, I didn't realise it was in reference to Ford the Australian prisoner...thanks for the clearup.

Fents · Post by **Fents** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:15 pm

shepherd wrote:so who's going into business with me - i just trademarked 'FREE SHAPELLE'

I'm rich biatch!!

her names spelt Schapelle innit? If it is u just owned urself.

quick · Post by **quick** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:16 pm

at Dave Valuetime, my thoughts exactly.

Their country, their laws. Foriegn policies between our countries have nothing to do with this case. It'll be a shame if this has an escalating effect on them.

Guyno · Post by **Guyno** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:19 pm

mecka wrote:

I'm tired of hearing all the crap about this. No offense but what implications could this possibly have on the Australian population at large, the relationship between Australia and Indonesia, or any of you lot?

There are countless other people who've been arrested for drug smuggling in Indonesia, but NONE of them garner the same attention as this idiot does. Why? Boobs is why. Constant protestations of innocence is why. Having a goddamn media circus is why.

I am so fucking over it.

Take her out on a beach at dawn to be shot or let her rot in a cell or even let her go.

I couldn't give a fuck.

wasp · Post by **wasp** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:22 pm

I think everyone's getting just a little bit too emotional about this one.....
Hands up who was there.......
Hands up who sat in on the court procedings........
Hands up who knows she is/isnt guilty for a FACT......

Her lawyers say they'll appeal, she is being given due process in the country she was in when she was alledgedly involved in criminal activity.
If u go to a place like that there is of course a chance u could go down for 20yrs.

I think the lesson for us here is don't go somewhere they can cap u for a bit of weed if you're not willing to take that chance of being framed or whatever (even if it is a remote chance). If you're afraid of fire u dont go visit a volcano........

I'm not saying I have no sympathy for the situation but lets calm down folks.......

shepherd · Post by **shepherd** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:24 pm

Fents wrote:
shepherd wrote:so who's going into business with me - i just trademarked 'FREE SHAPELLE'

I'm rich biatch!!
her names spelt Schapelle innit? If it is u just owned urself.

no no no ... i'm trying to own others..

i also registered 'FREE SCHAPELLE' at the same time ... who's laughing now.

ok ok - i owned myself

btw - how long until the boogie board bag is on ebay?

Fents · Post by **Fents** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:29 pm

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll ... eName=WDVW

funkypaws · Post by **funkypaws** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:36 pm

Just another battle in the "war on drugs".

Even if she was guilty, I don't think she deserves a sentence like that. And everyone on this board who seems to be OK with this, I hope you're all extremely straight edge in your recreational habits, otherwise you're being a bit hypocritical. Every single one of us who has ever enjoyed an evening's herbal or chemical entertainment, we are all part of this global situation, the terrible consequences of the "war on drugs".

SoulWhiteMan · Post by **SoulWhiteMan** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:37 pm

My comments were made moments after the verdict was handed down. The emotion from this (extreme empathy to Corby, the length of the sentence and the fact the bali bomber got 3 yrs) is what inspired the spout of racist, unfounded (and reading over them now) just plain stupid remarks...
I have since taken my dog for a walk and calmed the fuck down, and seen the ignorance of my writing. I hope none of you hold this against me, as it is really not in my character to be like this.
I absolutely apologise to anyone I offended.
Intelligence, and not ignorance is the only way to improve the world.

SoulWhiteMan · Post by **SoulWhiteMan** » Fri May 27, 2005 4:42 pm

valuetime wrote:
Rob M wrote:like i said before. Indonesia doesn't seem to give a toss about this, just posession and testimonials from officials that witnessed the events that unfolded.
agreed. but that's how their system has always worked. it's not perfect, but ours sure as fuck isn't either. i just don't think it's surprising or controversial.

from their perspective, any high profile defendant has to get the book chucked at them, otherwise its not zero tolerance. whether or not countries should have zero tolerance for anything, or whether narcotics should be illegal are the interesting debates, imo.

indeed. I remember the heroin trafficker who got found guilty (and didn't dispute the fact he was guilty) and was on international news crying saying he'll never see his children again.
They shot him one week early just to make a point.

RMHC · Post by **RMHC** » Fri May 27, 2005 5:12 pm

funkypaws wrote:Just another battle in the "war on drugs".

Even if she was guilty, I don't think she deserves a sentence like that. And everyone on this board who seems to be OK with this, I hope you're all extremely straight edge in your recreational habits, otherwise you're being a bit hypocritical. Every single one of us who has ever enjoyed an evening's herbal or chemical entertainment, we are all part of this global situation, the terrible consequences of the "war on drugs".

dont see your point, by using illicit substances, you thereby assume the risk of being caught with these substances, i assume we all understand this and take the concequence into account, it is a very different risk to do so in Australia than to do so in indonesia, (where i wouldnt dream of doing drugs). Therefore the points are valid, maybe made without any empathy but valid nonetheless

funkypaws · Post by **funkypaws** » Fri May 27, 2005 5:18 pm

The points may be valid, but hypocritical nonetheless. The international drug trade all operates as one big web, with one goal in mind, wealthy westerners who want the stuff. I wouldn't do drugs in any other country with harsh penalties either, but I understand that I can't divorce myself and my habits from the risks some people take when importing/exporting this stuff.

RMHC · Post by **RMHC** » Fri May 27, 2005 5:20 pm

funkypaws wrote:The points may be valid, but hypocritical nonetheless. The international drug trade all operates as one big web, with one goal in mind, wealthy westerners who want the stuff. I wouldn't do drugs in any other country with harsh penalties either, but I understand that I can't divorce myself and my habits from the risks some people take when importing/exporting this stuff.

absolutley, empathy is good and wonderful thing, point taken

SoulWhiteMan · Post by **SoulWhiteMan** » Fri May 27, 2005 5:32 pm

valuetime wrote:dude, you gotta respect other countries' laws and shut the fuck up.

Bali bomber conspires and kills many tourists 3yrs
Corby: brings some dacka into the country: 20

that just doesn't add up

valuetime · Post by **valuetime** » Fri May 27, 2005 6:28 pm

and in saudi arabia you can be beheaded for being gay...

and in america black people are 20 times more likely to be convicted of cocaine charges than white people...

so these things are fucked up? sure, but it doesn't help to say that towel heads are barbaric and that all niggers smoke rock. if you have no respect for other places in the world and their customs then you're missing the point and you're a racist fuck.

but that's just my opinion. don't take it personally.

LÃ³s Kasinoâ€” · Fri May 27, 2005 6:30 pm

interesting point to note,

that judge has sentanced ALL of 500 drug cases to imprisonment !

is that justice ????